Requiring landlords to share tenants' names, numbers untenable?

Anyone checking our address on the Assessors site has our personal information available. Why is asking landlords to register the name and phone number of a tenant considered an invasion of privacy?

BY CHRISTINE KRALY
ckraly@nwitimes.com
219.662.5335 | Sunday, January 25, 2009 | 3 comment(s)
Region towns and cities might now know more about renters than ever before.

A growing number of local municipalities have begun requiring landlords to pay annual fees and list their properties with housing or code enforcement departments.

A few communities with such programs -- Hammond, Griffith and Munster -- now are asking for personal information about the units' tenants.

But some critics say that requesting such information might unfairly target renters and place an undue burden on landlords.

http://nwi.com/articles/2009/01/25/opinion/forum/docd853af0d08a28baf862575450060c66c.txt

I dont know what the big deal is about asking for a name and a phone number?! The way I explain it to the people asking and the Times reporter is if I have a problem with a property I would rather call the tenant and get it fixed instead of cite the landlord. Some how that didnt get printed.

I have felt that the Times has had a bias towards landlords for quite some time. Last year, when code enforcement busted a drug in an illegal cut-up in the Harrison Park neighborhood, the Times didn't even publish the story until they received several emails and calls about it. Take a look at this quote from the story.Mangus, a Realtor who conducts business and has lived in other areas of the region, including Hammond, said he could see problems with such rules in some communities.

Many local landlords are small business owners, not corporations managing vast campuses, he said.

"They're running a very tiny business," he said. "Likely, (the landlord) does not have a warm and fuzzy feeling for government, and it's understandable."
Why not interview some of the homeowners in neighborhoods blighted by cut-ups? They will tell you they don't have a warm and fuzzy feeling for landlords who rent apartments to drug dealers and ruin those neighborhoods in the process. I think it's time for Kelly or Jim to take Christine Kraly to one of the cut-ups they bust so she can see for herself the places these slumlords pass off as "apartments".

As far as I am concerned it is an open invitation! I wonder if she even bothered to look at our registration form? Somewhere somebody made a big stink about this and it grew legs. I dont see it amounting to anything but couple this with a House Bill that wants to eliminate registering rentals altogether and all the sudden it seems there is a concentrated effort by landlords to stop us from seeking safe housing.

[b]I dont get a warm and fuzzy feeling when I talk to some landlords either!

When i lived in an apartment complex, my name and address was not registered with the city I lived in.

I can understand wanting to register rentals, but I see no reason why the tenants info should be registered

What happens if the tenants phone is disconnected? Would that fall to me to fix as a landlord?

Mike, I got a problem with this too. This is a slippery slope. How much longer will it be, that every person in every apartment, house, whether they are renting or not, and all people who might be living there, have to be registered? Can you say, PAPERS, PLEASE?

I don't believe that there are many valid reasons not to ask for a tenants name and social security number. I believe that it is only a matter of time before tenants are legally required to present valid ID's to lease an apartment. It is already mandatory to prove your identity to obtain a job, why not extend that requirement to leasing an apartment? We can continue to spend billions of dollars in a futile attempt to "secure" our borders or our government can adopt some common sense policies to stem illegal immigration. It's pretty hard to live in this country if no one will hire you or rent you an apartment.

There is one valid concern Sparks, that is PRIVACY

Just so you know, you DO NOT have to give your employer a copy of your social security card, that is just one of several different ID's that you have to show

http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/I-9.pdf

Right there, you do not need to give them your Social Security card. I gave my current employer a copy of my birth certificate and drivers license. No social security card to worry about

Keep in mind, there is a very valid reason why most places now do not want a copy of the social security card, and thats identity theft. Remember when banks wanted people to put their SS #'s on checks? Now they instead recommend drivers license numbers instead.

Sorry but to require a copy of a social security card to rent an apartment when to get a job its not required is wrong

I remember hearing at crime watch meetings last year that code enforcement sometimes would use rental agreements as proof of residence when trying to enforce vehicle license plate registration.

mike3775 wrote:

There is one valid concern Sparks, that is PRIVACY

Just so you know, you DO NOT have to give your employer a copy of your social security card, that is just one of several different ID's that you have to show

http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/I-9.pdf

Right there, you do not need to give them your Social Security card. I gave my current employer a copy of my birth certificate and drivers license. No social security card to worry about

Keep in mind, there is a very valid reason why most places now do not want a copy of the social security card, and thats identity theft. Remember when banks wanted people to put their SS #'s on checks? Now they instead recommend drivers license numbers instead.

Sorry but to require a copy of a social security card to rent an apartment when to get a job its not required is wrong

Mike,
I never mentioned anything about social security cards. I said I thought that tenants will someday be required
to provide social security numbers. The link that you posted is from 1986. In 2004, the laws regarding employment were changed. All new hires must provide their social security number. The employer is required to verify that the SSN is valid with the SS administration. Your concerns about privacy tell me that you really aren't aware how freely information about us circulates in our society. The ability to remain anonyomous no
longer exists in Western society. Almost every action we take, from being born to passing away generates a digital record. Schools, medical treatment, driver's license, insurance, credit and employment all create data about you that is recorded. We have exchanged privacy for security and freedom in our society. I personally like the freedom to take my Am Ex card and my passport to the airport and fly anywhere I care to in this world. I would like to see the Federal gov ignore all the wackos and conspiracy nuts and adopt a national ID card. I think protecting the country against terrorists and stopping the flow of illegals into our country is more important than "privacy" that no longer exists.

That was my whole problem with the article and the reporter. Who said anything about Social Security cards? All we ask for is tenant name and phone number. You would think that the reporter would at least go online and look at the registration form...of course that would be investigative reporting and we all know the Times doesnt pay for that. I dont care if they are illegal, employed, married or gay. All we want is to get a problem resolved without having to take someone to court !

Hey Sparks, if it is from 1986 like you claim, how come it states revised 6/5/07 in area's of the form? Oh and I highly doubt the Department of Homeland Security was in existence in 1986 either(page 2), yet its on that I-9 form that I linked to, which is located on a government website by the way. I am against a national ID card, because what happens if I lose my wallet? Bye Bye national ID with all my personal information perfect for ID thieves to get info from.

And I never gave my employer a copy of my social security card, I gave them my SS#, but never a copy of the card

I would never give the city my SS#, because they do not need to know it, unless I work for the city, but then I would bring in my birth certificate and drivers license and guess what, I satisfied the requirements for the I-9 form for employment. If the city wants proof of residence, then a copy of a bill and a drivers license is all they need. No need for them to have my SS# at all.

Just a name and phone number Mike...thats all we ask for !

voter3 wrote:

Just a name and phone number Mike...thats all we ask for !

But what happens if the phone is disconnected or they change it? Would I be getting a phone call asking for the number?

No but you would get a call to rectify the situation or possibly a citation if you can not be contacted.

Personally I would rather just avoid court altogether but sometimes it is inevitable.

I lost what I was originally writing. I agree with Voter only because while I was renting, I knew a lot of old folks that lived around me, and some dope addicts took advantage of my one dear old friend, wiped out his bank account, and caused his death.

The two daughters lived out of state, and when it came time to sell or rent, they thought it would be good to rent. The lawyer advised them that if they rented to dope addicts, and something happened, it could take the house away from them. They took the advice and sold. Good thing, cuz that neighborhood is now drug-infested (Hegewisch).

I think the police already have an idea where there is a rental, and it's my opinion, you should keep in touch with housing and the cops, cuz if you are out of town, at least they know the people by name and number if things go south, and the owner is out of town. If it is an emergency.

Suppose a part of the rental agreement is they keep up with the yard, etc., and you decide to inform the cops/inspectors of this aspect of the lease. At least they can reinforce it, and also notify you that someone that is renting is not taking care of the property. It only benefits...people should know who is renting next door, and how well they are taking care of the property. It's called pride, and who wants drug dealers in their rentals?

When I rented, over the years, if the management company didn't take care of a problem, I called the inspectors' office. Sometimes you have landlords that don't care; you can't reach them, and sure, the city knows who owns it, but doesn't mean the tenants aren't following the rules. They sure do need to know the names and phone numbers of tenants in case there is an emergency with the rental, and the owner is out of town. I agree with that part.

mike3775 wrote:

When i lived in an apartment complex, my name and address was not registered with the city I lived in.

I can understand wanting to register rentals, but I see no reason why the tenants info should be registered

What happens if the tenants phone is disconnected? Would that fall to me to fix as a landlord?

Mike, I stated above...when you are renting, you need to allow that information out to whom you are renting to if you are out of town and an emergency arises. What if they are dealing drugs...your rental is at stake.

If the people that rent had to give you their names, etc., why would you object to giving that information for safety's sake to even protect yourself with the lease to the proper officials to keep calm, integrity, whatever? In this day and age, you can't be sure unless you personally know the people you rent to. Background checks do not guarantee a good tenant. I'm all for registering the full name and address of the renters. What have you got to loose except a bunch of criminals that wouldn't want to be exposed?

What's the big deal? If they're good enough for you to rent out, you shouldn't find it a problem to give the same information to the cops/code-enforcement, so they can contact YOU when you are out of town, and something is happening that these tenants may be trying to hide from you. What have you got to lose? No social security number is required, just the name and number. Ask the cops to do a background check, and go enjoy life after you rent out.