snow removal update. the blizzard of 79 revisited?

well, we (street dept) got caught up on the weekend snow during the day today...and are currently awaiting another 2-4 inches to begin in a few hours. (my guess is most will get called out around 2 am to get ready for morning rush) but the amount isnt the concern...its the damned projected winds.

first off 20/30 mph out of the north west...means snow will be drifting bigtime...woe to those of you with houses facing the north tonight. but secondly this means salt will be virtually useless as a tool as well.....but the worst possibility...a low pressure bringing northerly winds...could bring a deluge of lake effect our way tomarrow. anyone older than about 20...or from a little ways east of here can tell you what that could mean. be on your guard folks

btw...update on the salt. im told the ice storm a few weeks back really hurt our supplies. we have already gone through half of our planned alottment for the season...and with two full months of the season to go...it could be close. so dont expect a lot of salt to be on the streets tomarrow morning in particular. in the meantime our officials are trying to line up additional supply options that the city can afford.

the hope is we can get our streets clean by quitting time tomarrow...and rest up for the next batch...6 inches which is forecast for wednesday. but if the lake effect gets turned on this may be the last post i make until at least thursday as we may work straight through. oh...and did i mention the freezing cold forecast in between the storms and after the wed storm?

havent had a start to a winter like this around her since 1979! which btw occurred on january 12!
http://www.chicago-l.org/mishaps/blizzard79.html
oh the memories.

I really don't recall but didn't the then mayor get voted out the following election? I do remember Chicago's mayor got the boot.

Regardless of the reasons the streets have often been more of an ice rink this year more than others of recent memory, particularly frustrating on Christmas Day for some reason, and fairly or not it's the luck of the draw that many people will remember those icy streets come next election.

I don't know what can be done even given unlimited funding to address this problem of ice. It seems to me like some type of technology must exist to combat this problem such as some type of heating system embedded in major roads or whatever. Something!

Yeah, here's my sure fire solution to winter driving.
Stay home in bad weather.
If you have to go out, slow the f@#$ down!
Four wheel drive and anti-lock brakes won't help when you drive like a moron.
It's a good thing Hammond isn't in the snow belt.

If we were we would have mandatory studded tires in winter and the problem would be solved.

actually today wasnt bad at all. most got called out late last night...i came out early this morning. despite the cold the sun helped melt the mains pretty good...so the roads werent too bad at all by late morning.

the late december storm was a rare ice storm. not that ice storms are rare...but to have ice accumulation over a half inch?...well that hasn't happenned in anyone's memory around here before. unfortunately that storm was impossible to plow. salt and time was necessary to do anything with that ice...and a lot of it.

tonight isnt going to be bad at all. tomarrow? well well have to wait and see, but right now it looks bleak.

They always make the weather sound worse than it turns out to be - on the news channels/weather channels. However, I found it not that bad around Hammond.

In fact, I got so excited yesterday, I was almost was tempted to go to an empty lot and do some "donuts". I used to love doing that when I was in my twenties. Nothing makes my belly get the willies except when I'm doing donuts in the car.

Anyway, I found it ok to drive around - I take my neighbor's daughter to school at 6:30 a.m., and though it isn't far, it wasn't that bad.

I did hear about that chain-reaction crash involving 25 vehicles on the 49 Exit to the tollway. I hate the fact that since it has been leased, it seems the foreignors don't know how to keep up with it. It's very disappointing.

I do want to know, Oracle, if the state is liable for snow removal on the tollway, or is it up to the lessee?

Actually they can only deal with possibilities and probabilities. When conditions change, as they do more in some areas than in others, it makes them seem wrong a lot. I'm actually amazed how often they get it right in FL. One now deceased weatherman in Tampa Bay used to predict the high temp within 3 degrees for months at a time and was rarely off my very much even then.

Hi Buddy! Missed ya! Yeah, well, I'd love that weatherman's or weatherperson's job. They never have to be accurate on the job. Just take a microphone, hype yourself up with layers of clothing, stand on an over-pass and make it sound like it's as bad as the Joe in the studio said.

Actually, in Florida, how can you be off the mark? It's darn hot down there!!!!

Still, do you know who is liable for the snow plowing on the toll way? Just curious!!!!

UrRight wrote:

I did hear about that chain-reaction crash involving 25 vehicles on the 49 Exit to the tollway. I hate the fact that since it has been leased, it seems the foreignors don't know how to keep up with it. It's very disappointing.

I hate to tell you this, but that exit was resurfaced not more than 4 or 5 months ago. The last time I can remember that exit being resurfaced was around 2001

Say what you want, but those operators have been making improvements to area's that the state had been neglecting

I like this cold weather

LOL...to Mirage and Mikey

Well, guess it's getting plowed by a Joe. Guess the exit is being taken care of, but why all the complaints on the comments on NWITimes.com, that the toll road is not being plowed or salted?

Neverthelss, I may have been wrong. Was that chain reaction where one got killed, did that occur at I-65 or a certain mile marker on the tollway?

By the way Mikey, you in fact posted that the tollway was being neglected when you took rode it to Chicago. Or, am I dreaming?

Well, neither of you answered me directly. Who the heck is in charge of plowing/salting the Cline Avenue thing by the boats? Or the tollway that leads from Indiana to Michigan? Just curious!!!

Mike, when I curse this weather, I think about how hot summer is...and it passes the day.

the toll road operating company employs its own street crews to maintain that road. i believe many of them are former state indot employees. its possible on some rural stretches of the road that they pay the state for salting and plowing services, but i dont know.

as for hammonds roadways. biggest problem is the cold. we have scraped as much of the snow as is possible off everything. side streets and alleys included. but the stuff is still going to be slick until things warm up on saturday.

as i said in my first post here. salt is a worry right now...so we used as little as possible on wednesday (with more snow that came in on wed night). we used more today, but with the colder temps the success rate of that salt is mixed. even with the cold temps one more sunny day should improve the roads further tomarrow.

in case your wondering. for the latest snow batch street crews were out from about 8 pm on tues through through 8 pm last night ...and were back out this morning at 3 am. we did get off an hour early today to get some rest though.

for those that havent yet, id advise digging out your cars and moving them asap. police are now ticketing and possibly towing cars that havent been moved at all in the past couple of weeks on the street (the mountain of snow is a dead giveaway). besides the fact that its illegal to park cars and leave them anywhere on the street for more than 72 consecutive hours, these snowbound cars make for dangerous situations when the snow melts and then freezes as ice on the side streets. its also very difficult for plow operators to see these snow covered cars in the night amidst all of the snow. which poses quite a crash risk.

and while i know it can be difficult. please park as close to the curb as is possible. more than a few times today we had to get pd's help to move cars that were blocking plows from getting through some of the side streets.

i suspect we will be out on the sidestreets again friday cleaning up the edges where parked cars have been moved. so even if we have gotten under your car earlier in the week. if possible move it to a cleaner area of the street, and we will plow the inch or so that is now in your parking space again.

some snow expected friday into saturday. hopefully not much though as we are running out of places to put it. heres hoping anyway, i think we can all use the rest.

My street is plowed very lovely, thank ya very much. We only have two neighbors that don't have driveways, and one neighbor who parks half way on his parkway sideways, and is gone before 7 a.m. until late at night.

No problem on my street. And thank'ya very much for your hard work.

It's a hard job driving those big trucks around. The weather is dreadful, you lack sleep, may God give you guys a real big break! Good job.

i love plowing streets like that ur!

its not too hard staying warm (unless your driving #54 which has little heat) for me a lot of caffien and 5 minute breaks every couple of hours are the key to staying alert. for 54?...rolling the window down for a second or two keeps him awake pretty easilly.

I spent much of the day yesterday on the roads and there was a huge difference in the condition of Hammond's roads and the surrounding communities. Heading south on Columbia, the road was snow covered and slick until you crossed 80/94 into Munster and then Columbia was dry and ice free. Munster is doing a far better job of applying salt than Hammond. Earlier in the thread, the Oracle wrote this regarding salt.

The Oracle wrote:

as i said in my first post here. salt is a worry right now...so we used as little as possible on wednesday (with more snow that came in on wed night).

. Keeping roads free of ice is a safety issue.Roads near the schools were slick and I saw several cars slide and nearly hit kids going to school. The goal should not be using as little salt as possible, it should be using as much salt as needed to get the job done. I think whoever makes the decisions regarding salting Hammond's streets has their priorities mixed up.

Mirage wrote:

Actually they can only deal with possibilities and probabilities. When conditions change, as they do more in some areas than in others, it makes them seem wrong a lot. I'm actually amazed how often they get it right in FL. One now deceased weatherman in Tampa Bay used to predict the high temp within 3 degrees for months at a time and was rarely off my very much even then.

That;s because the weather in Fla is fairly stable.

Most of the time perhaps. But they still seem to be pretty spot on when the weather isn't stable, like hurricane season. In fact the local forecasters seem to be more accurate than what you see from the national media coverage. Sometimes I see the national report and wonder what they're talking about because they are so way off.

In defence of our city; when I went out during the storm Wed. as soon as I hit Ridge road the snow tapered off. No joke, it was snowing like hell on 169th st., but not a flake to be seen by 45th ave.
That's the odd thing about lake effect snow, it's almost like someone draws a line and the snow doesn't cross it.
I went to school last night (at Ivy Tech) and the roads in E.C. are just as bad.
Salt doesn't work work at below zero temps.