Obama plans to bill wounded vets for medical care

The Obama admistration is moving forward with a plan that "breaks the sacred trust" between the gov't and our troops.
The idea is to have a wounded troopers' private insurance pay for va medical care. This is an outrage that the administration claims they will abandon if there is enough protest.
Read more at:
VFW WEBSITE
and please write to congressman Petey and our senators.
Thanks.
Bill

If you read the link you posted, it contradicts your contention that the Obama administration is moving forward with this plan.

Quote :

"The president told us that he would not go through with the third-party billing proposal if he felt the veterans' community didn't approve of it," said Glen M. Gardner Jr., who leads the nation's largest organization of combat veterans. "We made our opposition clearly known."

Keep in mind at this point there isn't even a plan in place, just discussions about different options that can be taken to increase the amount of resources available to provide care for wounded vets. I think the vets will be better served if the different vet groups don't take such short sighted,partisan positions regarding proposals to provide better care for vets.

Actually if you re-read Bill's post closely he states: This is an outrage that the administration claims they will abandon if there is enough protest.

So there was really no contradiction. Just thought I'd point it out in case you overlooked it.

sparks wrote:

If you read the link you posted, it contradicts your contention that the Obama administration is moving forward with this plan.

wrote:

"The president told us that he would not go through with the third-party billing proposal if he felt the veterans' community didn't approve of it," said Glen M. Gardner Jr., who leads the nation's largest organization of combat veterans. "We made our opposition clearly known."

Keep in mind at this point there isn't even a plan in place, just discussions about different options that can be taken to increase the amount of resources available to provide care for wounded vets. I think the vets will be better served if the different vet groups don't take such short sighted,partisan positions regarding proposals to provide better care for vets.

Excuse me? The Federal Government has a MORAL OBLIGATION to serve it's veterans. Selling to an insurance company would only limit and put caps on the care that our veterans deserve. This would be an outrage IF the Obama administration didn't already pooh-pooh the idea. You can sure tell Barry hasn't served in the military.

You mean this same administration that is now offering a whopping $500 bonus if our troops voluntarily remain in harm's way following their tour obligation?

Mirage wrote:

You mean this same administration that is now offering a whopping $500 bonus if our troops voluntarily remain in harm's way following their tour obligation?

That is such a gross misrepresentation of the facts that it is disgraceful, Mirage. I don't know where the hell you get your information, but the fact of the matter is that $500 a month extra is being provided to our soldiers who are under "stop-loss," and those payments are retroactive to October of 2008. It's part of a total phase out of the practice of forcing our soldiers to stay in the Army after they have fulfilled their obligation. The phase out was announced today by the Secretary of Defense.

Army to Phase Out 'Stop-Loss' Practice

Quote :

"I felt, particularly in these numbers, that it was breaking faith" to keep soldiers in the service after their end date comes up, Gates said. "To hold them against their will . . . is just not the right thing to do," he said at a Pentagon news conference.

The Army Reserve will no longer mobilize units under stop-loss policy beginning in August, the Army National Guard will follow suit in September, and the active-duty Army, by January. Currently, the Army has 1,452 Reserve soldiers, 4,458 National Guard troops and 7,000 active-duty soldiers on stop-loss.

Effective this month, the Army will also pay soldiers who are under stop-loss an extra $500 per month, and those payments will be retroactive to October, when they were authorized by Congress, Gates said.

You really need to start providing links when you make accusations. Your characterization of this policy isn't even remotely factual. Is it really that hard to do some basic fact checking before you post?

Fine.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/03/18/armyenddate/
"Our goal is to cut the number of those stop-lost by 50 percent by June 2010 and to eliminate the regular use of stop-loss across the entire Army by March 2011," Gates said.

Which implies that if they are needed it may not be so voluntary in all cases. Still, $500 ain't nothin'. I'm making no apologies for Bush. The military put in their tours and especially in the case of reserve & guard troops should have a right to go home and get back to their real lives. Make it $1,000 and I'd agree with the plan being a fair offer.

I can't say how the soldiers may react to the bonus offer but if this program is successful it won't be because of a puny $500 but instead because they have the character to go above and beyond the call of duty to see this thing through to the end.

Mirage wrote:

Fine.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/03/18/armyenddate/
"Our goal is to cut the number of those stop-lost by 50 percent by June 2010 and to eliminate the regular use of stop-loss across the entire Army by March 2011," Gates said.

Which implies that if they are needed it may not be so voluntary in all cases.

Sparks wrote:

The entire stop-loss program is involuntary,which is the point you can't seem to grasp!

Still, $500 ain't nothin'. I'm making no apologies for Bush. The military put in their tours and especially in the case of reserve & guard troops should have a right to go home and get back to their real lives. Make it $1,000 and I'd agree with the plan being a fair offer.

I can't say how the soldiers may react to the bonus offer but if this program is successful it won't be because of a puny $500 but instead because they have the character to go above and beyond the call of duty to see this thing through to the end.

Even after Scorpion calls you out because you don't seem to have a grasp of the facts, you still continue to post the same thing. Here is a link that describes the "stop loss" policy that Bush used extensively during the Iraq war to force troops to remain in the service for up to six years beyond the tour of service soldiers believed they were signing up for. The reason that the government had to enforce the "fine print" in soldier's contracts is that the Bush admin. was totally unwilling to raise military pay high enough to attract the number of recruits needed. Luckily, we now have a President who understands how wrong this policy was and is going to abolish it and financially reward soldiers who are still being impacted by it.

This ain't about Bush - it's about Obama. Regardless of what Bush did or didn't do this isn't his proposal and the $500 is an insult. That's the point!

Mirage wrote:

This ain't about Bush - it's about Obama. Regardless of what Bush did or didn't do this isn't his proposal and the $500 is an insult. That's the point!

You still don't seem to get it.Obama is undoing Bush's policy that unfairly forced our soldiers to remain in the service involuntarily after they had served their agreed upon tour of duty. Since there aren't enough trained soldiers in the pipeline to replace them, he is phasing the program out as fast as he can and paying the affected soldiers an additional $500/month. How is that insulting? Bush's treatment of our soldiers during his eight years is what is really insulting.

sparks wrote:

Mirage wrote:

This ain't about Bush - it's about Obama. Regardless of what Bush did or didn't do this isn't his proposal and the $500 is an insult. That's the point!

You still don't seem to get it.Obama is undoing Bush's policy that unfairly forced our soldiers to remain in the service involuntarily after they had served their agreed upon tour of duty. Since there aren't enough trained soldiers in the pipeline to replace them, he is phasing the program out as fast as he can and paying the affected soldiers an additional $500/month. How is that insulting? Bush's treatment of our soldiers during his eight years is what is really insulting.

OMG. I can't believe that he is still going on about this. I'll try one more time.

Mirage, there is nothing voluntary about "stop loss." We're now simply providing an extra $500 a month to those soldiers who are being forced to serve beyond their obligation. That policy can't be immediately stopped, so this extra money is being provided during the "phase-out" period. Now let's go back to your original post.

Mirage wrote:

You mean this same administration that is now offering a whopping $500 bonus if our troops voluntarily remain in harm's way following their tour obligation?

Again, the $500 is being provided to those soldiers who are "stuck" in the service by the stop-loss policy, involuntarily. This isn't some "prize" being dangled in front of our soldiers in order to get them to volunteer for anything.

Do you get it now?

Damn Mirage, pay attention. Scorpion is kicking your butt. Ya know there could be a test and I think you're going to fail.

Damn Mirage, pay attention. Scorpion is kicking your butt.

Well then I guess it must be true since I saw it written on the internet along with a bunch of pro-Obama propaganda.

Conservative mantra for years has been dont let the facts get in the way for what they know is true. Rush has survived for years based on thiis.

Mirage wrote:

This ain't about Bush - it's about Obama. Regardless of what Bush did or didn't do this isn't his proposal and the $500 is an insult. That's the point!

This really is about Bush and Obama's attempt to fix the mess Bush has left him. Bush's utter failure to support our troops in Afganistan and Iraq has had some very disturbing real-life consequences. If Bush had been a responsible leader, he would have done whatever in took to recruit and train enough soldiers to get the job done. Instead, the military was forced to use the stop-loss policy to force soldiers to remain after their agreed upon terms had been fulfilled. By overworking our troops, the stress and exhaustion Bush's policies created have lead to a record number of suicides in the military.
http://www.military.com/news/article/army-reports-alarming-rise-in-suicides.html
"In January, we lost more soldiers to suicide than to al-Qaida," said Paul Rieckhoff, director of the Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America. He urged "bold and immediate action" by the departments of Defense and Veterans Affairs.

Once again, this Obama's plan. Don't think I ever said I supported Bush's stop loss decision, especially on an extended basis, but the point is $500 ain't enough, the plan still won't be optional for everyone to choose to accept the money and stay or not, and people are getting fed up with Bush being blamed for every half baked Obama initiative.

By overworking our troops, the stress and exhaustion Bush's policies created have lead to a record number of suicides in the military.

So how is $500 going to make them less stressed and overworked? And to that let me add that if the commanders in the field ask for 20,000 new troops but Congress only approves 18,000 that's indicative of the mentality that caused troops to be stressed and overworked.

Mirage wrote:

Once again, this Obama's plan. Don't think I ever said I supported Bush's stop loss decision, especially on an extended basis, but the point is $500 ain't enough, the plan still won't be optional for everyone to choose to accept the money and stay or not, and people are getting fed up with Bush being blamed for every half baked Obama initiative.

By overworking our troops, the stress and exhaustion Bush's policies created have lead to a record number of suicides in the military.

So how is $500 going to make them less stressed and overworked? And to that let me add that if the commanders in the field ask for 20,000 new troops but Congress only approves 18,000 that's indicative of the mentality that caused troops to be stressed and overworked.

It is absolutely indictative of the mentality that existed in Washington during the "lost" Bush years. For six years, the Republicans controlled the White House and both branches of Congress and were far more concerned about tax cuts for the rich than the troops in the line of fire.

sparks wrote:

Mirage wrote:

Once again, this Obama's plan. Don't think I ever said I supported Bush's stop loss decision, especially on an extended basis, but the point is $500 ain't enough, the plan still won't be optional for everyone to choose to accept the money and stay or not, and people are getting fed up with Bush being blamed for every half baked Obama initiative.

By overworking our troops, the stress and exhaustion Bush's policies created have lead to a record number of suicides in the military.

So how is $500 going to make them less stressed and overworked? And to that let me add that if the commanders in the field ask for 20,000 new troops but Congress only approves 18,000 that's indicative of the mentality that caused troops to be stressed and overworked.

It is absolutely indictative of the mentality that existed in Washington during the "lost" Bush years. For six years, the Republicans controlled the White House and both branches of Congress and were far more concerned about tax cuts for the rich than the troops in the line of fire.

Sorta like giving George Pabey a free pass just because Pastrick ruled for so long.

News flash - the Dems have held Congress for a couple of years now. Funny how they are somehow blameless even though they are the ones doing it now. Kinda sick of the politics here when the Dems ran on a platform of improvement, not deficit spending and lying about protecting the bonuses of executives in a private firm who just happened to get Federal taxpayer sponsored bailout money to add to that deficit, and then pass a clearly unenforceable action the tax the money back. Gee, maybe they weren't really trying to get the money back after all? Perhaps it's a PR stunt??

Can't wait for 2010! I may just put my name on a ballot and see how I do against the party of "change."

Mirage wrote:

Once again, this Obama's plan. Don't think I ever said I supported Bush's stop loss decision, especially on an extended basis, but the point is $500 ain't enough, the plan still won't be optional for everyone to choose to accept the money and stay or not, and people are getting fed up with Bush being blamed for every half baked Obama initiative.

Damn, Mirage. Why is this so difficult for you to grasp? The plan isn't optional for anyone. There is no "choice" involved. Again, those that are "stuck" by the previous administration's stop-loss policy, which is now being phased out, will get an extra $500 a month. That's it. That's the entire new policy. It's not an incentive. Our soldiers can't decide "to stay or not." Many will be stuck until the the phase out is complete. In the meantime, they will get an extra $500, retroactive to October. Period.

It's incredible to me that you still don't "get it." It's been explained to you, again and again, yet you're still making statements based upon a false premise.

What is your problem understanding this? The stop loss program was the brainchild of the Bush Administration. I don't give a damn if you are "fed up" with Bush being blamed for everything or not. The new administration is phasing out Bush's program. The new administration is simply trying to provide our soldiers who are affected by the old program with a little extra money while the old program is being phased out.

What's so hard to understand about $500 ain't enough?

Mirage wrote:

What's so hard to understand about $500 ain't enough?

You have failed the test Mirage! F

Mirage wrote:

What's so hard to understand about $500 ain't enough?

No amount of money is ever going to be enough to compensate our soldiers for the unnecessary hardships that they have had to endure, and will continue to endure, as a result of the Bush Administration's "stop loss" policy which was really nothing more than a "backdoor draft" policy. I'm sure that our soldiers would rather be home with their families than be forced to serve beyond their obligation. BTW - the $500 was authorized by Congress last October.

What you call "Obama's policy," is actually the phase-out of the stop loss program. The stop loss policy was a Bush program, and Obama is ending it. I'm sure our troops are very happy that the phasing out of this misguided and demoralizing policy has finally begun.

Scorpion wrote:

Mirage wrote:

What's so hard to understand about $500 ain't enough?

No amount of money is ever going to be enough to compensate our soldiers for the unnecessary hardships that they have had to endure, and will continue to endure, as a result of the Bush Administration's "stop loss" policy which was really nothing more than a "backdoor draft" policy. I'm sure that our soldiers would rather be home with their families than be forced to serve beyond their obligation. BTW - the $500 was authorized by Congress last October.

"Obama's policy," is the phase-out of the stop loss program. The stop loss policy was a Bush program, and Obama is ending it. I'm sure our troops are very happy that the phasing out of this misguided and demoralizing policy has finally begun.

The career military men we know do not speak highly of GWB at all. Morale in the armed forces is terrible because of the stop-loss policy and the scandals at VA hospitals.

Scorpion wrote:

Mirage wrote:

What's so hard to understand about $500 ain't enough?

No amount of money is ever going to be enough to compensate our soldiers for the unnecessary hardships that they have had to endure, and will continue to endure, as a result of the Bush Administration's "stop loss" policy which was really nothing more than a "backdoor draft" policy. I'm sure that our soldiers would rather be home with their families than be forced to serve beyond their obligation. BTW - the $500 was authorized by Congress last October.

What you call "Obama's policy," is actually the phase-out of the stop loss program. The stop loss policy was a Bush program, and Obama is ending it. I'm sure our troops are very happy that the phasing out of this misguided and demoralizing policy has finally begun.

You mean it was authorized under Bush's administration?? SAY IT AIN'T SO! It was the very least that could be done for these families. But I may be with Mirage, I'd like to see them get more than just $500 a month for xtra for what they endure.