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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   1/6/2016, 1:34 pm

Oregon militants keeping women and children around at standoff despite threats to kill or be killed
Quote :
The militants occupying an Oregon nature preserve are apparently using women and children as human shields.

Television crews and newspaper photographers have shown women and children visiting the Malheur National Wildlife Reserve, where at least two dozen self-described militiamen have brought their guns and demanded the release of two ranchers sentenced in an arson case.

The militants are also demanding that the Bureau of Land Management turn over the nature preserve to local authorities for private use.

Federal authorities, however, have said they intend to flush out the armed militants by shutting off utility service to the visitors center they took over Saturday evening following a demonstration.

One of the militants’ supporters, Joe Oshaugnessy, said in a Facebook post that the government would be to blame if that shutoff caused any harm to the women and children
Quote :
staying on the grounds.

“Just a quick reminder if they do shut down the electricity to the facility they will be shutting off the heat to woman and children who are also at the refuge,” Oshaugnessy said. “With temperatures of -16 in the area let’s pray they don’t.”
Joe Oshaugnessy post (Facebook)

There’s actually no outside forces stopping those women and children — or the militants, for that matter — from leaving the nature preserve.
Nice to see them still employing the same tactics as ISIS Evil or Very Mad They were going to use women as shields at the earlier Bundy ranch sausage fest showdown .
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   1/6/2016, 3:44 pm

Why would you call for tanks to be sent in against those who were committing no violence, but have this response for authorities who responded when faced with actual violence?:

Artie60438 wrote:
The police response last night was disgraceful. Arresting reporters,tear gas,stun grenades,military assault rifles pointed at citizens, and shutting down a McDonalds for no reason at all.

I asked you the same question earlier, and your response was ….,

Artie60438 wrote:
There was no violence on the date I commented on. See for yourself...

…. a response that I proved was false, several posts back.

Have you reconsidered and come up with a suitable and truthful answer?
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   1/6/2016, 4:19 pm

happy jack wrote:
Why would you call for tanks to be sent in against those who were committing no violence, but have this response for authorities who responded when faced with actual violence?:

Artie60438 wrote:
The police response last night was disgraceful. Arresting reporters,tear gas,stun grenades,military assault rifles pointed at citizens, and shutting down a McDonalds for no reason at all.

I asked you the same question earlier, and your response was ….,

Artie60438 wrote:
There was no violence on the date I commented on. See for yourself...

[b]…. a response that I proved was false, several posts back.

Have you reconsidered and come up with a suitable and truthful answer?
According to the sources you presented there were a couple of molotov cocktails shown which were thrown or attempted to be thrown in response to the police gassing the crowd and arresting reporters.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   1/6/2016, 5:51 pm

Artie60438 wrote:
   
According to the sources you presented there were a couple of molotov cocktails shown which were thrown or attempted to be thrown in response to the police gassing the crowd and arresting reporters.
   

Which sources?
Could you be more specific?

That aside, why do feel that it is perfectly fine to “send in the tanks” to deal with the militia group that is refusing lawful orders to cease the occupation of public property, yet it is not OK to use non-lethal smoke bombs and non-lethal tear gas in dealing with those who refused lawful orders to cease the occupation of public property in Ferguson?
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   1/6/2016, 10:31 pm

Sleep
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   1/7/2016, 8:22 am

Artie60438 wrote:
Sleep

As soon as the paint dries, I'll let you know. Then you can come out of your corner.

Artie60438 wrote:
   
These were crimes committed by individuals,not an organized group armed to the teeth.

Your contention that a single individual cannot, without being part of some larger organized group, commit an act of terrorism has been duly noted.
We will most certainly revisit that assertion in the future.
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Scorpion

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   1/7/2016, 7:24 pm

happy jack wrote:

Artie60438 wrote:
   
These were crimes committed by individuals,not an organized group armed to the teeth.

Your contention that a single individual cannot, without being part of some larger organized group, commit an act of terrorism has been duly noted.
We will most certainly revisit that assertion in the future.

That's a "step too far," Jack.  Artie made no such contention and by twisting what he said into a fabricated "assertion," you've walked directly into straw man territory.

You should have quit while you were ahead.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   1/8/2016, 12:42 pm

Scorpion wrote:
happy jack wrote:

Artie60438 wrote:
   
These were crimes committed by individuals,not an organized group armed to the teeth.

Your contention that a single individual cannot, without being part of some larger organized group, commit an act of terrorism has been duly noted.
We will most certainly revisit that assertion in the future.

That's a "step too far," Jack.  Artie made no such contention and by twisting what he said into a fabricated "assertion," you've walked directly into straw man territory.

You should have quit while you were ahead.



Bullshit, and "straw man", my ass.
A person who is harmed by “individuals” is no less harmed than one who is harmed as the result of an act perpetrated by an organized group. Or do you believe otherwise? (And by the way, simply using the term “individuals”, rather than ‘an individual’, constitutes acknowledgement of the participation of a group. You know – that pesky little ‘s’ at the end of the word.)  So why, in that case, would you not "send in the tanks"?.
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Scorpion

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   1/8/2016, 1:30 pm

happy jack wrote:
Scorpion wrote:
happy jack wrote:

Artie60438 wrote:
   
These were crimes committed by individuals,not an organized group armed to the teeth.

Your contention that a single individual cannot, without being part of some larger organized group, commit an act of terrorism has been duly noted.
We will most certainly revisit that assertion in the future.

That's a "step too far," Jack.  Artie made no such contention and by twisting what he said into a fabricated "assertion," you've walked directly into straw man territory.

You should have quit while you were ahead.



Bullshit, and "straw man", my ass.
A person who is harmed by “individuals” is no less harmed than one who is harmed as the result of an act perpetrated by an organized group. Or do you believe otherwise? (And by the way, simply using the term “individuals”, rather than ‘an individual’, constitutes acknowledgement of the participation of a group. You know – that pesky little ‘s’ at the end of the word.)  So why, in that case, would you not "send in the tanks"?.

I don't have any idea what the hell you're talking about... but it's clear that you're missing the point.

I simply pointed out that Artie never "contended that a single individual cannot, without being part of some larger organized group, commit an act of terrorism."

Are you really going to pretend that he did?
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   1/8/2016, 7:35 pm

Scorpion wrote:
   
I simply pointed out that Artie never "contended that a single individual cannot, without being part of some larger organized group, commit an act of terrorism."  



Using those precise words?
No, he didn’t.
But when deciding when to “send in the tanks”, why differentiate between acts committed by unaffiliated individuals and those committed by a cohesive group?
One is just as much terrorism as the other, but it's abundantly clear that he doesn’t see it that way.
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chuckmo48

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   1/11/2016, 9:58 am

Speaking of Tea-Baggers...Why no right wing outrage because of Raphael Cruz Jr's parents?  His dad Raphael Sr, never became a citizen until 2005, his mother, as of 2013 was still eligible to vote in Canada, and of course Jr who only dropped his Canadian citizenship in 2014?
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   1/11/2016, 4:17 pm

chuckmo48 wrote:
Speaking of Tea-Baggers...Why no right wing outrage because of Raphael Cruz Jr's parents?  His dad Raphael Sr,  never became a citizen until 2005, his mother, as of 2013 was still eligible to vote in Canada, and of course Jr who only dropped his Canadian citizenship in 2014?



Now yew go on and yew chase that squirrel, boy.
Go on, now!
Git!
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   1/11/2016, 10:33 pm

chuckmo48 wrote:
Speaking of Tea-Baggers...Why no right wing outrage because of Raphael Cruz Jr's parents?  His dad Raphael Sr,  never became a citizen until 2005, his mother, as of 2013 was still eligible to vote in Canada, and of course Jr who only dropped his Canadian citizenship in 2014?
Chuck,I believ that falls under the IOKIYAR rule "It's ok if you're a Republican". Oh,and not being black really,really,helps too. Wink


Can't accuse this one of being a hypocrite though... Very Happy
Orly Taitz "Consistent" in Claiming Ted Cruz Can't Be President for Same Reason as Obama
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   1/26/2016, 9:40 pm

Awesome Very Happy
Shots fired, Bundys arrested in Oregon standoff; one dead
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Authorities say shots were fired during the arrest of members of an armed group that has occupied a national wildlife refuge in Oregon for more than three weeks.

In a statement Tuesday, the FBI said one individual "who was a subject of a federal probable cause arrest is deceased." No other information about the deceased was immediately released.

The FBI said authorities arrested Ammon Bundy, 40, his brother Ryan Bundy, 43, Brian Cavalier, 44, Shawna Cox, 59, and Ryan Payne, 32, during a traffic stop Tuesday afternoon on U.S. Highway 395. Authorities said another person, Joseph Donald O'Shaughnessy, 45, was arrested in Burns.

Bundy's group, which has included people from as far away as Arizona and Michigan, seized the headquarters of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge on Jan. 2 as part of a long-running dispute over public lands in the West.

Bundy is the son of Nevada rancher Cliven Bundy, who was involved in a high-profile 2014 standoff with the government over grazing rights.
A storybook ending as far as I'm concerned cheers
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   1/31/2016, 9:38 pm

How sad Sad
Remaining Oregon occupiers claim FBI has shut down their phones and cut off their Internet access
Quote :
Four of the Oregon occupiers remain holed up in the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge and are now claiming that the FBI is cutting them off from the outside world by blocking their phone calls and shutting off Internet service.

According to OPB, David Fry — who has yet to surrender to federal law enforcement — said he can still receive calls on his phone but not call out. He claimed that phones belonging to the other occupiers have become worthless; unable to call out or receive calls as well as access the Internet.

Writing on Facebook, militant supporter and Oath Keeper member Greg Whalen claims he talked with Fry who confirmed the phone shutdown, but added that other supporters who try to call Fry now end up speaking with the FBI instead.

According to Whalen, occupier Sandy Anderson said they have no plans to surrender.

“They will not come out and Sandy wanted me to put it out there that if news reports say they surrendered… it was not by their free will,” Whalen wrote. “Once again, they have no internet.”
I sure hope the cable isn't out too Razz

Quote :
According to OPB, the militants have moved outside of the Malheur refuge buildings and are using a generator for power.

They said they weren’t sure if power has been cut off to the buildings in the national park.

The holdouts include Fry of Blanchester, Ohio, husband and wife Sean and Sandy Anderson of Riggins, Idaho, and Jeff Banta of Elko, Nevada.

The four previously indicated they would surrender if they were pardoned, along with the everyone else taken into custody for the four week occupation of the national park.

“That’s our current demand. Everybody’s got to be pardoned. We all gotta go free. We all get to go home. Other than that, (we) don’t know what’s going to happen next,” Fry said.

“We all want to leave,” Sandy Anderson added. “We’re here, and we’re worried we’re going to die.”
Cheer Up,You'll be getting free room and board soon Very Happy
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   2/3/2016, 6:34 pm

Prosecutors Bring Sealed Indictment In Bundy Case
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Federal prosecutors managing the government’s case against Ammon Bundy and other militants involved in an armed takeover of an Oregon wildlife refuge filed a sealed indictment against the militants Wednesday.

The prosecutors brought the indictment to Magistrate Judge Janice Stewart during a hearing in federal court Wednesday. Defense attorneys stated they had not seen the indictment before the proceeding. Stewart ordered prosecutors to turn over a copy of the document to defense attorneys within the next 24 hours.

“I think we should be able to see the charges the government is alleging against our client,” said Mike Arnold, the lead defense attorney for Ammon Bundy following the hearing in downtown Portland. “I think we should be able to see them now.”

Bundy and several other militants had been scheduled to appear in court for a pretrial hearing Wednesday, but those hearings were stricken from the court docket hours before they were scheduled to happen.

Prosecutors said Ammon Bundy, Ryan Bundy, Ryan Payne and other militants are named in the indictment.

Federal prosecutor Geoff Barrow told the Associated Press the indictment involves the 11 people arrested so far “and others.”

“There are likely other people who are included that they don’t want to revel yet,” said Lisa Hay, an attorney in the federal public defender’s office.

She said the pretrial hearing would’ve been an opportunity for defense attorneys to question law enforcement about their statements made in criminal complaints. Hay said there have been questions raised by other attorneys about the accuracy of some of the statements in the criminal complaint.

“You only have the right to have the officer take the stand on a criminal compliant,” Hay said referring to the cancelled hearing. “Now that there’s an indictment, that means in theory that the government presented evidence to a grand jury that found there was probable cause to bring a criminal charge against them.”

Because the indictment handed down is sealed, the details of the charges are not available. The document could be partially unsealed within the next 24 hours.

An attorney for Shawna Cox said her clients wanted to attend the funeral of deceased militant Robert LaVoy Finicum on Friday in Utah. Under the conditions of her release, Cox is not allowed to communicate with co-conspirators. The judge denied Cox’s request.

As of Wednesday, four armed militants remain engaged in a standoff with federal law enforcement at the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge.

Two militants, Duane Ehmer and Brian Cavalier, have their initial detention hearings in Portland Thursday afternoon. Internet radio talk show host Pete Santilli, who prosecutors say is also part of the occupation, has the continuation of his appealed detention hearing late Thursday.

Ammon Bundy and other armed occupiers have arraignments scheduled for Feb. 24.
Personally I think a nice touch would be charging some of them with murder since someone died during the commission of their felony.

In any event...Say goodbye to your gunz,boys Very Happy
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   2/8/2016, 6:27 pm

Keep digging,geniuses...
Remaining occupiers release defiant videos mocking FBI
PORTLAND, Ore. (AP) — The last four occupiers of an Oregon wildlife refuge have posted a series of defiant videos in which one of them calls FBI agents losers, shows a defensive perimeter they have built and takes a joyride in a government vehicle.[/quote]
Quote :
A defensive perimeter? Yeah,that'll work Rolling Eyes
The videos were posted Sunday on a YouTube channel called Defend Your Base, which the armed group has been using to give live updates. The holdouts are among 16 people charged with conspiracy to interfere with federal workers in the armed standoff over federal land policy that has surpassed five weeks.
Thank heaven for Youtube Very Happy
Quote :
In one of the new videos, occupier David Fry says the FBI told him he faces additional charges because of defensive barricades the four have built.

"We just got done talking with the FBI," said the 27-year-old Blanchester, Ohio, resident. "They consider fortifying a crime."
Hmm,Imagine that!

Quote :
Fry said he, Jeff Banta of Nevada, and husband and wife Sean and Sandy Anderson of Idaho have "every right" to defend themselves from the "oncoming onslaught of people with fully automatic rifles (and) armored vehicles.

"I'm tired of you guys telling us what we can and can't do," he says.
Yeah,see how that works out for you.

Quote :
Then Fry shows government vehicles they have been using without permission. He walks up to a white truck and says, "I think I'm going to take it on a little joyride.

"Now you've got another charge on me FBI. I'm driving your vehicle."

FBI spokeswoman Beth Anne Steele said the agency had no comment on the videos.

In another video posted Sunday, Sean and Sandy Anderson are sitting together and the husband says they feel like hostages because they can't leave without being arrested.

"What are they to do with us?" Sean Anderson says. "They either let us go, drop all charges because we're good people, or they come in and kill us. How's that going to set with America?"
Enjoy Laughing
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   2/11/2016, 11:15 pm

Turn out the lights..the party's over...
Oregon Occupiers Formally Surrender After A Tense Night Nearly Turned Violent
Quote :
More than a month after armed men and women first seized an Oregon wildlife refuge, federal agents moved in on the last stragglers from that group on Wednesday night and demanded their surrender. The group reportedly agreed to yield on Thursday at roughly 8 a.m. local time, with two conservative public figures shepherding the handover. Two hours later, after a drawn out negotiation with one last occupier, David Fry, the occupation finally ended.

The four holdouts from the original group set up a live stream on YouTube during the tense, hours-long standoff Wednesday, allowing tens of thousands of people to listen in to their end of the climactic encounter. The four repeatedly refused to exit the building they were in, saying they believed the feds were only pretending to allow them to surrender so that they could get a clean shot and kill them all. They also vowed to fire live ammunition at police if they launched tear gas. For long stretches of time, the situation seemed likely to veer in a deadly direction.

But in the end, the occupiers agreed to disarm and surrender themselves in the morning so long as the right-wing Reverend Franklin Graham, who spoke with one occupier by phone during the standoff, was on hand to physically escort them off the refuge. It took more than an hour from the first time that possibility was raised for the group to agree to it, in part because they remained convinced that the FBI would come in shooting overnight and in part because they said they would never agree to go to prison or give up their guns.

The icing on the cake?
Nevada Rancher Cliven Bundy Charged With Conspiracy, Extortion

Quote :
Arrested Thurday, Bundy faces multiple charges for his standoff with federal authorities over unpaid grazing fees.


Nevada rancher Cliven Bundy was charged Thursday with six federal felony counts, including conspiracy, use of a deadly weapon, obstruction of justice, and extortion.

Bundy, whose sons Ammon and Ryan Bundy led the armed occupation of Malheur National Wildlife Refuge, was not charged for his involvement in the Eastern Oregon takeover—but for leading a 2014 armed standoff with federal authorities in Nevada over unpaid grazing fees totaling $1 million.

The rancher was charged with "leading a massive armed assault" against federal agents who were planning to seize his cattle. The federal officials backed away from a confrontation at the time.

Bundy was arrested Wednesday night when he arrived at Portland International Airport to visit his sons, Ammon and Ryan Bundy, and to visit the Malheur occupation, which he has encouraged. He has joined his sons in lockup.
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   2/17/2016, 6:29 pm

Cliven Bundy, called ‘lawless and violent,’ to stay in jail
Quote :
PORTLAND, Ore. (AP) — Nevada rancher Cliven Bundy, who came to Oregon to support the armed occupation of a national wildlife preserve led by his sons, will remain in jail pending trial after prosecutors called him "lawless and violent."

U.S. Magistrate Judge Janice Stewart said Tuesday that Bundy should not be released ahead of trial because there is a risk he won't show up for future court dates. "If he is released and he goes back to his ranch, that is likely the last the government will see of him," Stewart said.

Bundy, 69, was arrested in Portland last week on charges stemming from a 2014 armed standoff with federal officials who were rounding up his cattle over unpaid grazing fees.

The elder Bundy was not charged in connection with the Oregon occupation. All his charges stem from the 2014 Nevada standoff: conspiracy, assault on a federal officer, obstruction, weapon use and possession, extortion to interfere with commerce, and aiding and abetting.

Bundy is accused of unlawfully directing more than 200 followers to stop federal agents and contract cowboys who were trying to enforce a court order to round up about 400 of his cattle two years ago.

"Witnesses have described the level of threatened violence as so intense that something as innocent as the backfire of (a) vehicle, or someone lighting a firecracker, would have set off a firefight," according to a 34-page document filed by prosecutors Tuesday.

They called him "lawless and violent" and say that Bundy and his followers set up traffic checkpoints on public roads and followed and intimidated federal officials trying to conduct plant surveys.

Neither the Constitution nor any other law "gives anyone the right to use or carry, let alone brandish, raise or point, a firearm" at federal law enforcers performing official duties, "whether one thinks the officer is acting constitutionally or not," prosecutors wrote.

To diffuse the standoff, the government released the cows.

Federal authorities have said Bundy owes more than $1 million in fees and penalties for letting cows graze illegally for decades on public land near his ranch.

Quote :
If convicted of all six charges, he could spend the rest of his life in federal prison.
cheers cheers cheers
Very Happy
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Tea Party Terrorism   3/10/2016, 3:35 pm


While it's not terrorism it is another glaring example of Tea party goons out of control. Even worse is that the sheriffs escorting the man out ignored the man who assaulted this guy and instead took the victim to the ground and handcuffed him. I guess they must be Trump supporters too.
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