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edge540

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 2:03 pm

happy jack wrote:
The employee presumably understood the organizational philosophy of the company when he hired in, then voluntarily chose to deviate from that philosophy, breaking the implicit contract.  It’s really as simple as that.

So Hobby Lobby requires it's emplyees to adhere to a religious philosophy-“counter(ing) the promotion of the homosexual agenda,” when they are hired? Hobby Lobby asks if you support the promotion of the homosexual agenda?

And that's an "implicit contract"?

Can you prove that?
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 2:20 pm

edge540 wrote:
happy jack wrote:
The employee presumably understood the organizational philosophy of the company when he hired in, then voluntarily chose to deviate from that philosophy, breaking the implicit contract.  It’s really as simple as that.

So Hobby Lobby requires it's emplyees to adhere to a religious philosophy-“counter(ing) the promotion of the homosexual agenda,” when they are hired? Hobby Lobby asks if you support the promotion of the homosexual agenda?

And that's an "implicit contract"?

Can you prove that?



Can I prove what?
You do realize, don’t you, that we have been discussing a hypothetical situation?
If you still stand by your claim from a few posts back, that you respect the right of a private organization to insist that its members adhere to its philosophy and that the NBA has the right to sanction Sterling, then you should agree that an organization such as Hobby Lobby has the same right in regard to its own employees. You cannot have one without the other.
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 2:25 pm

Scorpion wrote:

Yeah.  You see, Artie?  He's not lying, because even though you started ignoring him before the verdict, it is also true that you have ignored him since the verdict.  Why that is relevant is beyond me.  But it's undeniably true.
It's only relevant in the twisted world of our house troll,Scorpion.

He focuses on the Zimmerman verdict date to make it appear as if the result of the verdict was the catalyst for my decision to ignore him. As you correctly pointed out,I started ignoring him 2 weeks earlier,well before the verdict,and well before anyone could guess the eventual outcome of the trial.

His overall obnoxious and dishonest behavior is the reason he is basically on Ignore,not the outcome of the Zimmerman trial.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 2:28 pm

Artie60438 wrote:
Scorpion wrote:

Yeah.  You see, Artie?  He's not lying, because even though you started ignoring him before the verdict, it is also true that you have ignored him since the verdict.  Why that is relevant is beyond me.  But it's undeniably true.
It's only relevant in the twisted world of our house troll,Scorpion.

He focuses on the Zimmerman verdict date to make it appear as if the result of the verdict was the catalyst for my decision to ignore him. As you correctly pointed out,I started ignoring him 2 weeks earlier,well before the verdict,and well before anyone could guess the eventual outcome of the trial.

His overall obnoxious and dishonest behavior is the reason he is basically on Ignore,not the outcome of the Zimmerman trial.

happy jack wrote:

What is also undeniably true, for those of us honest enough to admit it, is that, had the verdict gone the other way, he would not have been ignoring me for long.
You know that, I know that, and Artie knows that.
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edge540

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 3:23 pm

happy jack wrote:
edge540 wrote:
happy jack wrote:
The employee presumably understood the organizational philosophy of the company when he hired in, then voluntarily chose to deviate from that philosophy, breaking the implicit contract.  It’s really as simple as that.

So Hobby Lobby requires it's emplyees to adhere to a religious philosophy-“counter(ing) the promotion of the homosexual agenda,” when they are hired? Hobby Lobby asks if you support the promotion of the homosexual agenda?

And that's an "implicit contract"?

Can you prove that?



Can I prove what?
You do realize, don’t you, that we have been discussing a hypothetical situation?
If you still stand by your claim from a few posts back, that you respect the right of a private organization to insist that its members adhere to its philosophy and that the NBA has the right to sanction Sterling, then you should agree that an organization such as Hobby Lobby has the same right in regard to its own employees. You cannot have one without the other.

Being a member of an organization like the NBA and being an employee of a company like Hobby Lobby are two very different things and what you're claiming are two different issues.
Sorry that you're all mixed up, jack.

You're claim that Hooby Lobby can fire an employee for not adhering to a religious, anti gay agenda is bullshit, IMHO.


Last edited by edge540 on 5/1/2014, 3:32 pm; edited 1 time in total
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 3:31 pm

edge540 wrote:
happy jack wrote:
edge540 wrote:
happy jack wrote:
The employee presumably understood the organizational philosophy of the company when he hired in, then voluntarily chose to deviate from that philosophy, breaking the implicit contract.  It’s really as simple as that.

So Hobby Lobby requires it's emplyees to adhere to a religious philosophy-“counter(ing) the promotion of the homosexual agenda,” when they are hired? Hobby Lobby asks if you support the promotion of the homosexual agenda?

And that's an "implicit contract"?

Can you prove that?



Can I prove what?
You do realize, don’t you, that we have been discussing a hypothetical situation?
If you still stand by your claim from a few posts back, that you respect the right of a private organization to insist that its members adhere to its philosophy and that the NBA has the right to sanction Sterling, then you should agree that an organization such as Hobby Lobby has the same right in regard to its own employees. You cannot have one without the other.

Being a member of an organization like the NBA and being an employee of a company like Hobby Lobby are two very different things and are two different issues.
Sorry that you're all mixed up, jack.



Sorry that's it's taken you a dozen posts and a thousand words to pussy out of addressing a question that could have been answered with a simple yes or no.
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edge540

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 3:34 pm

happy jack wrote:



Sorry that's it's taken you a dozen posts and a thousand words to pussy out of addressing a question that could have been answered with a simple yes or no.

So that means I was right when I said you're full of shit, correct?
I didn't "pussy out" of anything, I simply proved you're a troll babbling nonsense as usual.
Good to see you agree with this:
You're claim that Hobby Lobby can fire an employee for not adhering to a religious, anti gay agenda is bullshit.


Grab some ice jack, LOL.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 6:04 pm

edge540 wrote:
happy jack wrote:



Sorry that's it's taken you a dozen posts and a thousand words to pussy out of addressing a question that could have been answered with a simple yes or no.

So that means I was right when I said you're full of shit, correct?
I didn't "pussy out" of anything, I simply proved you're a troll babbling nonsense as usual.
Good to see you agree with this:
You're claim that Hobby Lobby can fire an employee for not adhering to a religious, anti gay agenda is bullshit.


Grab some ice jack, LOL.




The only ice I'll need is for my gin and tonic, which I'll drink while pondering why you even involved yourself in this thread unless, of course, you fully intended to expose yourself as a first-class hypocrite. If that was your goal, then, well done.
If you still stand by your claim from a few posts back, that you respect the right of a private organization to insist that its members adhere to its philosophy and that the NBA has the right to sanction Sterling, then you should agree that an organization such as Hobby Lobby has the same right in regard to its own employees. You cannot have one without the other.
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edge540

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 7:03 pm

happy jack wrote:
edge540 wrote:
happy jack wrote:



Sorry that's it's taken you a dozen posts and a thousand words to pussy out of addressing a question that could have been answered with a simple yes or no.

So that means I was right when I said you're full of shit, correct?
I didn't "pussy out" of anything, I simply proved you're a troll babbling nonsense as usual.
Good to see you agree with this:
You're claim that Hobby Lobby can fire an employee for not adhering to a religious, anti gay agenda is bullshit.


Grab some ice jack, LOL.




The only ice I'll need is for my gin and tonic, which I'll drink while pondering why you even involved yourself in this thread unless, of course, you fully intended to expose yourself as a first-class hypocrite. If that was your goal, then, well done.
If you still stand by your claim from a few posts back, that you respect the right of a private organization to insist that its members adhere to its philosophy and that the NBA has the right to sanction Sterling, then you should agree that an organization such as Hobby Lobby has the same right in regard to its own employees. You cannot have one without the other.
Sure I can.
What the NBA did is not against the law. The NBA has the right to sanction Sterling for being a racist.
You're claim that Hobby Lobby can fire an employee for not adhering to a religious, anti gay agenda is against the law. Period.
Two different issues.
If you can't comprehend that, perhaps you've had too much gin and tonic.
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 7:08 pm

house troll wrote:

What is also undeniably true, for those of us honest enough to admit it, is that, had the verdict gone the other way, he would not have been ignoring me for long.
You know that, I know that, and Artie knows that.

Dream on you idiot. Not engaging with you certainly hasn't stopped me from making a fool out you every chance I get,has it?  Laughing 

Case in point,Your greatest hit to date: cheers 

dumb as a doorstop wrote:

And no, I am not one of those “unsuspecting Americans”. I suspected from the beginning that Obamacare was going to suck the big one.

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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 7:48 pm

edge540 wrote:


What the NBA did is not against the law. The NBA has the right to sanction Sterling for being a racist.
You're claim that Hobby Lobby can fire an employee for not adhering to a religious, anti gay agenda is against the law. Period.
Two different issues.
If you can't comprehend that, perhaps you've had too much gin and tonic.

It's not two different issues. It is two different situations involving the same issue - that of an organization dismissing an employee due to the discovery of a recording of the employee’s private conversation, in which the employee failed to adhere to his company’s organizational philosophy. And there is nothing inherently religious about having an anti-gay agenda, so religion does not even come into the equation. People have anti-gay agendas for many reasons. Regardless, this is hypothetical to begin with, so it really makes no difference what the organizational philosophy entails, whether it involves gay vs. anti-gay, racist vs. non-racist, pro-life vs. pro-choice - what matters is that the organizational philosophy was violated by the employee.
So, if you still stand by your claim from a few posts back, that you respect the right of a private organization to insist that its members adhere to its philosophy and that the NBA has the right to sanction Sterling, then you should agree that an organization such as Hobby Lobby has the same right in regard to its own employees. You cannot have one without the other.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 7:54 pm

Artie60438 wrote:
house troll wrote:

What is also undeniably true, for those of us honest enough to admit it, is that, had the verdict gone the other way, he would not have been ignoring me for long.
You know that, I know that, and Artie knows that.

Dream on you idiot. Not engaging with you certainly hasn't stopped me from making a fool out you every chance I get,has it?  Laughing 





It is specifically because of people like you that I found it necessary to add this qualifier to my post:

".... for those of us honest enough to admit it...."


That group clearly does not include you.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 8:12 pm

edge540 wrote:
   

What the NBA did is not against the law. The NBA has the right to sanction Sterling for being a racist.



And if a company that holds to the belief that marriage is between one man and one woman sanctions one of its employees who was secretly recorded promoting a same-sex marriage agenda, that company has not broken any law, either. If you hold it to the same standards to which you have held the NBA, that company would have every right to sanction that employee. Again, edge - you cannot have this both ways.
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edge540

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 8:48 pm

Please spare me all your nonsense and bullshit jack, Donald Sterling is not an employee. He's part of an exclusive billionaires mens club and because he's a racist they're kicking his ass out.
There is no employer-employee relationship. End of story.
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Scorpion

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 9:03 pm

edge540 wrote:
Please spare me all your nonsense and bullshit jack, Donald Sterling is not an employee. He's part of an exclusive billionaires mens club and because he's a racist they're kicking his ass out.
There is no employer-employee relationship. End of story.

Correct.

And as the Commissioner stated, it's no longer just a question of a private conversation, either.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/commish-adam-silver-s-bold-ban-of-clippers-owner-donald-sterling-was-long-overdue-from-nba-201427444-nba.html

Quote :
Silver said Sterling expressed no remorse or apology for what was said, which overrode concerns this was simply a private conversation.

"Whether or not these remarks were originally shared in private, they are now public and they represent his views," Silver said at a packed, nationally broadcast news conference in Manhattan.
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Heretic

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/1/2014, 10:24 pm

happy jack wrote:
And there is nothing inherently religious about having an anti-gay agenda, so religion does not even come into the equation. People have anti-gay agendas for many reasons.

Like what? Whatever it is, I'd imagine it's a very, very small percentage.
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edge540

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/2/2014, 9:07 am

Since he's so confused, maybe this video will help jack understand why comparing Donald Sterling to a Hobby Lobby employee is so stupidly absurd.

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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/2/2014, 12:20 pm

edge540 wrote:
Since he's so confused, maybe this video will help jack understand why comparing Donald Sterling to a Hobby Lobby employee is so stupidly absurd.




A portion of the players' responsibilities to uphold the rules of the NBA:

All Players shall be of good moral character and possess qualities which will make them proper members of their respective teams.

If the NBA is truly sincere about upholding their constitution and sweeping the undesirables out of their organization, then, to paraphrase Roy Scheider, "They're gonna need a bigger broom."
Unfortunately, they don't have the guts.



http://basketball.about.com/od/nbaplayers/tp/Nba-Sexcapades-Affairs-And-Other-Off-Court-Hijinks.htm

NBA Sexcapades: Affairs and other Off-Court Hijinks

By Charlie Zegers

The NBA: Where tawdry happens. Looking at some of the league's legendary off-court affairs -- from Tony Parker's "sexting" with a teammate's wife to the rumored affair between Delonte West and LeBron James' mother to Wilt Chamberlain's conquests.

1. JR Smith Fined $25,000 for Inappropriate Twitter Photo
New York Knicks guard JR Smith was fined $25,000 for posting a photo of a mostly-naked woman to his personal Twitter account.
The woman was apparently a guest in Smith's Milwaukee hotel room; the Knicks were in town to play the Bucks. The would go on to lose that game, the fourth in a losing streak that, as of March 14, has reached six straight.
2. Vanessa Bryant Files for Divorce
Vanessa Bryant - Kobe Bryant's wife of ten years - filed for divorce in December 2011, citing irreconcilable differences. That's sort of shocking, considering the fact that they were able to reconcile after Kobe was charged with sexual assault in 2003. (Kobe gave his wife a ring reportedly worth $4 million after that situation was resolved.)
So what finally put Mrs. Bryant over the edge? According to reports, Kobe had an average of ten affairs per year during the marriage. While that doesn't approach Wilt Chamberlain territory, 100 is still a very impressive number. (Insert joke about "volume scorers" here.)
According to a number of reports, the couple does not have a prenuptial agreement.
3. Tony Parker Caught "Sexting" With a Teammate's Wife
The marriage of Spurs guard Tony Parker and his actress wife Eva Longoria imploded when Longoria reportedly found "hundreds" of text messages linking her husband and the wife of an unnamed Spurs teammate.
4. Gloria James and Delonte West?
During the 2010 NBA Playoffs, the rumor mill was rife with stories that troubled Cavaliers guard Delonte West had an affair with Gloria James - LeBron James' mother. The story was given as one explanation for James' poor performance during the Cavs' second-round playoff series against the Celtics. Could this be one reason why LBJ decided to take his talent to South Beach?
5. The Mailman Hits on Kobe's Wife?
Malone was accused of making a pass at Mrs. Kobe Bryant at a Laker game in 2004. According to the story, Vanessa Bryant -- noting Malone's hat and boots -- asked "What you hunting, cowboy?" To which Malone responded, "I'm hunting for little Mexican girls."
Bryant was something less than thrilled at his ex-teammate's remarks.
6. Andrei Kirilenko's Wife is Very Liberal...
Masha Lopatova - wife of Utah forward Andrei Kirilenko - told ESPN the Magazine that she allows her husband to sleep with another woman once a year. Apparently a fair number of NBA husbands exercise the same privilege -- but more often, and without permission.
7. Shawn Kemp, Calvin Murphy and a Whole Lot of Kids
Fathering illegitimate children isn't exclusive to the NBA, but a few basketball stars raised it to an art form. For a time, Shawn Kemp -- father to seven children by six different women -- was the standard-bearer, but hall-of-famer Calvin Murphy was later revealed to have 14 kids by nine different women. (Murphy was also accused of molesting five of his daughters, but acquitted.)
8. Patrick Ewing at the Gold Club
The 2001 trial of Steven E. Kaplan had everything you'd want from an episode of Law & Order... strippers, mob ties, and a parade of NBA superstars -- most notably, Patrick Ewing -- testifying about the "services" they'd received at the notorious Atlanta strip joint "The Gold Club."
9. Magic Johnson and "The Bachelor Life"
Magic Johnson told reporters "After I arrived in L.A. in 1979, I did my best to accommodate as many women as I could -- most of them through unprotected sex." Sadly, his statement didn't come off as boasting -- the way Wilt Chamberlain's claims did -- because Johnson was explaining how he had contracted HIV.
10. Wilt Chamberlain's 20,000 Partners
Wilt Chamberlain famously boasted he'd had approximately 20,000 sexual partners in his lifetime. Don't try to do the math on that, it'll just give you a headache -- a problem that apparently didn't vex Wilt very often.


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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/2/2014, 12:33 pm

Heretic wrote:
happy jack wrote:
And there is nothing inherently religious about having an anti-gay agenda, so religion does not even come into the equation. People have anti-gay agendas for many reasons.

Like what?  Whatever it is, I'd imagine it's a very, very small percentage.



Imagine all you want.
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Scorpion

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/2/2014, 1:11 pm

happy jack wrote:

A portion of the players' responsibilities to uphold the rules of the NBA:

All Players shall be of good moral character and possess qualities which will make them proper members of their respective teams.

And?   What the hell has this to do with comparing Sterling to a Hobby Lobby employee?
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/2/2014, 1:19 pm

Scorpion wrote:
happy jack wrote:

A portion of the players' responsibilities to uphold the rules of the NBA:

All Players shall be of good moral character and possess qualities which will make them proper members of their respective teams.

And?   What the hell has this to do with comparing Sterling to a Hobby Lobby employee?



Ummmm .... perhaps  .... nothing?
Why do you ax?
edge brought it up, so I thought I'd comment on it.


Last edited by happy jack on 5/2/2014, 1:47 pm; edited 1 time in total
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edge540

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/2/2014, 1:25 pm

Scorpion wrote:
happy jack wrote:

A portion of the players' responsibilities to uphold the rules of the NBA:

All Players shall be of good moral character and possess qualities which will make them proper members of their respective teams.

And?   What the hell has this to do with comparing Sterling to a Hobby Lobby employee?

Looks like our resident troll is now claiming that virulent racism, being anti gay, and having affairs is all the same thing.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/2/2014, 1:44 pm

edge540 wrote:
Scorpion wrote:
happy jack wrote:

A portion of the players' responsibilities to uphold the rules of the NBA:

All Players shall be of good moral character and possess qualities which will make them proper members of their respective teams.

And?   What the hell has this to do with comparing Sterling to a Hobby Lobby employee?

Looks like our resident troll is now claiming that virulent racism, being anti gay, and having affairs is all the same thing.



No, I’m claiming that the leadership of the NBA purports to hold its members to high moral standards but applies the enforcement of those standards unequally. They simply do not have the guts to rid the league of the players who pay for their yachts. If they get rid of Sterling, people will still come and watch their games. If they get rid of Kobe Bryant and others of his playing caliber, …. well, not so much.
Tell me, edge – do you consider the players in the below examples to have demonstrated ‘good moral character’?


According to reports, Kobe had an average of ten affairs per year during the marriage.

Fathering illegitimate children isn't exclusive to the NBA, but a few basketball stars raised it to an art form. For a time, Shawn Kemp -- father to seven children by six different women -- was the standard-bearer, but hall-of-famer Calvin Murphy was later revealed to have 14 kids by nine different women.

Magic Johnson told reporters "After I arrived in L.A. in 1979, I did my best to accommodate as many women as I could -- most of them through unprotected sex."

Wilt Chamberlain famously boasted he'd had approximately 20,000 sexual partners in his lifetime.

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edge540

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/2/2014, 1:51 pm

happy jack wrote:
edge540 wrote:
Scorpion wrote:
happy jack wrote:

A portion of the players' responsibilities to uphold the rules of the NBA:

All Players shall be of good moral character and possess qualities which will make them proper members of their respective teams.

And?   What the hell has this to do with comparing Sterling to a Hobby Lobby employee?

Looks like our resident troll is now claiming that virulent racism, being anti gay, and having affairs is all the same thing.



No, I’m claiming that the leadership of the NBA purports to hold its members to high moral standards but applies the enforcement of those standards unequally. They simply do not have the guts to rid the league of the players who pay for their yachts. If they get rid of Sterling, people will still come and watch their games. If they get rid of Kobe Bryant and others of his playing caliber, …. well, not so much.
Tell me, edge – do you consider the players in the below examples to have demonstrated ‘good moral character’?


According to reports, Kobe had an average of ten affairs per year during the marriage.

Fathering illegitimate children isn't exclusive to the NBA, but a few basketball stars raised it to an art form. For a time, Shawn Kemp -- father to seven children by six different women -- was the standard-bearer, but hall-of-famer Calvin Murphy was later revealed to have 14 kids by nine different women.

Magic Johnson told reporters "After I arrived in L.A. in 1979, I did my best to accommodate as many women as I could -- most of them through unprotected sex."

Wilt Chamberlain famously boasted he'd had approximately 20,000 sexual partners in his lifetime.


Of course not and neither am I stupid enough to equate having sexual affairs and being anti gay with virulent racism....like you did.
As Bill Clinton demonstrated, most Americans don't give a flying fuck when comes to "getting some strange"...nice pun, eh?

Carry on troll boy.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Donald Sterling scandal   5/2/2014, 2:28 pm

edge540 wrote:
happy jack wrote:

Tell me, edge – do you consider the players in the below examples to have demonstrated ‘good moral character’?[/b]

According to reports, Kobe had an average of ten affairs per year during the marriage.

Fathering illegitimate children isn't exclusive to the NBA, but a few basketball stars raised it to an art form. For a time, Shawn Kemp -- father to seven children by six different women -- was the standard-bearer, but hall-of-famer Calvin Murphy was later revealed to have 14 kids by nine different women.

Magic Johnson told reporters "After I arrived in L.A. in 1979, I did my best to accommodate as many women as I could -- most of them through unprotected sex."

Wilt Chamberlain famously boasted he'd had approximately 20,000 sexual partners in his lifetime.


Of course not and neither am I stupid enough to equate having sexual affairs and being anti gay with virulent racism....like you did.



I’m not ‘equating’ anything with anything. But these examples of the behavior of certain players would, I believe, also be proscribed by the constitution of the NBA, yet these players, to the best of my knowledge, have never faced disciplinary action for this behavior, mainly because these players shovel incredible amounts of money into the pockets of those who would discipline them.
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