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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/7/2011, 12:15 pm

Artie60438 wrote:
happy jack wrote:
Artie60438 wrote:

I blame them both.
Although he had absolutely nothing to do with the killings and beheadings, you still blame the pastor for the deaths simply because he did something provocative that may have contributed to people being killed half a world away?
Have you ever considered that the Muslim murderers might be outraged over something completely different, like, I don't know... maybe the fact that Obama is bombing a Muslim country that did nothing whatsoever to threaten the United States?
Wouldn't you be just a wee bit more upset over seeing your fellow brothers in faith being killed by indiscriminate bombs than you would over seeing a single book being burned?
I know I would.
That's very odd, very backward thinking.
You might want to reconsider your theory.
No thanks! The New York Times seems to also agree with me.........
Afghans Avenge Florida Koran Burning, Killing 12
Quote :
MAZAR-I-SHARIF, Afghanistan - Stirred up by three angry mullahs who urged them to avenge the burning of a Koran at a Florida church, thousands of protesters on Friday overran the compound of the United Nations in this northern Afghan city, killing at least 12 people, Afghan and United Nations officials said.

Unable to find Americans on whom to vent their anger, the mob turned instead on the next-best symbol of Western intrusion - the nearby United Nations headquarters. "Some of our colleagues were just hunted down," said a spokesman for the United Nations Assistance Mission in Afghanistan, Kieran Dwyer, in confirming the attack.
And you are blaming this on the Florida pastor why ...?
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/7/2011, 1:07 pm

happy jack wrote:
Artie60438 wrote:
happy jack wrote:

Although he had absolutely nothing to do with the killings and beheadings, you still blame the pastor for the deaths simply because he did something provocative that may have contributed to people being killed half a world away?
Have you ever considered that the Muslim murderers might be outraged over something completely different, like, I don't know... maybe the fact that Obama is bombing a Muslim country that did nothing whatsoever to threaten the United States?
Wouldn't you be just a wee bit more upset over seeing your fellow brothers in faith being killed by indiscriminate bombs than you would over seeing a single book being burned?
I know I would.
That's very odd, very backward thinking.
You might want to reconsider your theory.
No thanks! The New York Times seems to also agree with me.........
Afghans Avenge Florida Koran Burning, Killing 12
Quote :
MAZAR-I-SHARIF, Afghanistan - Stirred up by three angry mullahs who urged them to avenge the burning of a Koran at a Florida church, thousands of protesters on Friday overran the compound of the United Nations in this northern Afghan city, killing at least 12 people, Afghan and United Nations officials said.

Unable to find Americans on whom to vent their anger, the mob turned instead on the next-best symbol of Western intrusion - the nearby United Nations headquarters. "Some of our colleagues were just hunted down," said a spokesman for the United Nations Assistance Mission in Afghanistan, Kieran Dwyer, in confirming the attack.
And you are blaming this on the Florida pastor why ...?
Simple.....for burning the Koran. Had he not done that there would have been nothing to avenge and those UN workers would still be alive. It's a simple case of one religious kook extremest inciting other extremests.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/7/2011, 1:26 pm

Artie60438 wrote:
happy jack wrote:
Artie60438 wrote:

No thanks! The New York Times seems to also agree with me.........
Afghans Avenge Florida Koran Burning, Killing 12
And you are blaming this on the Florida pastor why ...?
Simple.....for burning the Koran. Had he not done that there would have been nothing to avenge and those UN workers would still be alive. It's a simple case of one religious kook extremest inciting other extremests.

Yeah, Artie – and if the hot young woman hadn’t been wearing that tight black leather mini-skirt and push-up bra, she wouldn’t have been raped, right? It’s a simple case of one hot young woman inciting the quite natural urges in a man, isn’t it? It wasn’t his fault that he raped her, because, due to her attire, she obviously made him do it, correct?
By placing culpability on the pastor, you are making the identical leap of logic – that had there been no provocation, there would have been no crime. Unfortunately, people such as those who carried out these murders and beheadings would have done so for any reason – possibly because someone drew a cartoon of Mohammed, or possibly because someone sneezed in the general direction of Mecca.

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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/7/2011, 1:42 pm

happy jack wrote:
Artie60438 wrote:
happy jack wrote:

[bAnd you are blaming this on the Florida pastor why ...?[/b]
Simple.....for burning the Koran. Had he not done that there would have been nothing to avenge and those UN workers would still be alive. It's a simple case of one religious kook extremest inciting other extremests.

[bYeah, Artie – and if the hot young woman hadn’t been wearing that tight black leather mini-skirt and push-up bra, she wouldn’t have been raped, right? It’s a simple case of one hot young woman inciting the quite natural urges in a man, isn’t it? It wasn’t his fault that he raped her, because, due to her attire, she obviously made him do it, correct?
By placing culpability on the pastor, you are making the identical leap of logic – that had there been no provocation, there would have been no crime. Unfortunately, people such as those who carried out these murders and beheadings would have done so for any reason – possibly because someone drew a cartoon of Mohammed, or possibly because someone sneezed in the general direction of Mecca. [/b
b]
Did you not read the article I posted?? "MAZAR-I-SHARIF, Afghanistan - Stirred up by three angry mullahs who urged them to avenge the burning of a Koran at a Florida church, thousands of protesters on Friday overran the compound of the United Nations in this northern Afghan city, killing at least 12 people,[/b] Afghan and United Nations officials said."

Unless you can post something factual that proves otherwise,I'm through arguing with you on this.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/7/2011, 1:51 pm

Artie60438 wrote:
happy jack wrote:
Artie60438 wrote:

Simple.....for burning the Koran. Had he not done that there would have been nothing to avenge and those UN workers would still be alive. It's a simple case of one religious kook extremest inciting other extremests.

[bYeah, Artie – and if the hot young woman hadn’t been wearing that tight black leather mini-skirt and push-up bra, she wouldn’t have been raped, right? It’s a simple case of one hot young woman inciting the quite natural urges in a man, isn’t it? It wasn’t his fault that he raped her, because, due to her attire, she obviously made him do it, correct?
By placing culpability on the pastor, you are making the identical leap of logic – that had there been no provocation, there would have been no crime. Unfortunately, people such as those who carried out these murders and beheadings would have done so for any reason – possibly because someone drew a cartoon of Mohammed, or possibly because someone sneezed in the general direction of Mecca. [/b
b]
Did you not read the article I posted?? "MAZAR-I-SHARIF, Afghanistan - Stirred up by three angry mullahs who urged them to avenge the burning of a Koran at a Florida church, thousands of protesters on Friday overran the compound of the United Nations in this northern Afghan city, killing at least 12 people,[/b] Afghan and United Nations officials said."

Unless you can post something factual that proves otherwise,I'm through arguing with you on this.
You want factual?
How about something from the article that you yourself posted?


Stirred up by three angry mullahs...

Based on your article, it appears that the crowd was stirred up by the mullahs, not by the Florida pastor, who, to the best of my knowledge, was nowhere in the vicinity.
'Factual' enough for you?

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Heretic

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/8/2011, 12:15 am

happy jack wrote:
Based on your article, it appears that the crowd was stirred up by the mullahs . . .

Who were clearly taking advantage of yet another opportunity to portray any interaction with the US as another calculated move in the "Christian vs Islam" war. Terry Jones wasn't exactly sipping tea on his couch watching reruns of Father Dowling Mysteries; we can at least acknowledge that fact.

That said, however, my initial response to this incident was to blame Jones too, but after thinking about, I couldn't justify it. I can't blame Jones anymore than I could blame those cartoonists from a few years back.

The blog Cheap Signals specifically took that NYT article to task:

Quote :
Do I need to list off all of the absurd elements in this situation? Maybe I do:

  • Both sides were blaming enormous groups for the actions of individuals. In Jones' case it was the entirety of Islam for the acts of some terrorists; in the mob's case it was the entirety of America for the acts of a small congregation of loony Americans. And in the mob's case they not only decided to punish the group as a whole, but couldn't even be bothered to make sure that the people they attacked were even members of it or that the property they destroyed was owned by members of it.

  • Had the three mullahs in Mazari-i-Sharif not encouraged people to take to the streets and commit murder, they almost certainly would not have done so. Just as with the Danish cartoons depicting Muhammad, none of this destruction would have happened had it not been for mullahs stirring up the anger of Muslims.

  • And yet, Mullah Kashaf holds Jones responsible. He, along with President Karzai, want the United States to bring Jones to justice for doing something that is perfectly legal here. Jones burnt a book in another country; the mullahs actively incited violence in the angry mob standing before them. Obviously, Jones is the guilty party.


Let's be clear on one thing-- in no sense do I have to condone Jones' ideology, his hatred of Muslims, or his decision to burn a copy of their sacred text in order to hold the Afghani mullahs and rioters 100% responsible for what they did. They reacted violently in response to desecration of a symbol, a reaction to which Americans are not immune (as can be seen in the effort every couple of years to ban burning of the flag) but which for the most part we have rightly condemned as a fundamentally unacceptable response. Burning a sacred text is not shouting "Fire" falsely in a crowded theater; it is not incitement to violence; it is not a violation of anyone's property rights provided the copy you burn is your own. It is Constitutionally protected free speech in America, something that Afghanistan might want to try. There just might be fewer violent outbursts if their own government decided that the destruction of sacred symbols is not desirable but also doesn't justify attacking anyone or anything.

Jones is a massive tool, but I have to agree that the blame lies solely with the rioters.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/8/2011, 10:42 am

Heretic wrote:


That said, however, my initial response to this incident was to blame Jones too, but after thinking about, I couldn't justify it. I can't blame Jones anymore than I could blame those cartoonists from a few years back.



Jones is a massive tool, but I have to agree that the blame lies solely with the rioters.
Yeah, that's all I was saying. Jones is a narcissistic clown, but he is guilty of no more than being a narcissistic clown.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/18/2011, 1:23 pm

Heretic wrote:
Cheap Signals specifically took that NYT article to task:

They reacted violently in response to desecration of a symbol, a reaction to which Americans are not immune (as can be seen in the effort every couple of years to ban burning of the flag) ...

There is a wee bit of a difference between those who attempt to enact legislation to ban flag burning and those who burn down city blocks and murder innocent people, so I would argue that most Americans are "immune" to such reactions, with the exception of those responsible for the Rodney King riots, which, of course, had nothing to do with flag burning.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/18/2011, 1:26 pm

I nearly missed this article, what with all the media focusing primarily on the rampaging Mormons.



http://www.france24.com/en/20110418-north-riots-over-goodluck-jonathan-election-victory-nigeria
Riots break out in north as Jonathan landslide looms

Riots erupted across the mainly Muslim north of Nigeria on Monday as President Goodluck Jonathan looked set for a landslide win in a weekend poll, which observers have described as the fairest in decades.

By Douglas HERBERT in Abuja (video)

REUTERS - Violent protests erupted across Nigeria's largely Muslim north on Monday as youths angered at President Goodluck Jonathan's election victory torched churches and homes and set up burning barricades.
The vote count showed Jonathan, from the southern oil-producing Niger Delta, had beaten Muhammadu Buhari, a former military ruler from the north, in the first round.

Observers have called the poll the fairest in decades in Africa's most populous nation but Buhari's supporters accuse the ruling party of rigging. Results show how politically polarised the country is, with Buhari sweeping states in the Muslim north and Jonathan winning the largely Christian south.
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BigWhiteGuy

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/18/2011, 2:19 pm

UrRight wrote:
...and to think he has a crack at a second term.

Take the anticipated million and buy Haiti some toilet paper.
They're talking BILLION, with a "B".
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UrRight



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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/18/2011, 6:52 pm

Artie60438 wrote:
happy jack wrote:
Artie60438 wrote:
Yes,but a musical comedy that even Mormons themselves have praised isn't.
[b]Because you have cherry-picked quotes from 2 Mormons does not mean that everyone of the Mormon faith is okey-dokey with the musical. The fact that they have not beheaded anyone or burned Salt Lake City to the ground is a sign of a tolerant religion, not a sign that they have no reason to be offended by it.[/b
The fact that over 1.5 Billion Muslims in the world haven't beheaded or killed anyone over that jackass pastor's inflammatory actions is also a sign of a tolerant religion.


You are wrong, ARTiE. Millions of women have been raped, tortured and beheaded.

The only thing positive you can believe in...is those MUSLIM MEN cheat, keep their women off the street, an behead them for not abiding in their distorted belief in the Koran.

They are devils, in my eyes.
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UrRight



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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/18/2011, 7:12 pm

Burn a Koran here...restlessness in the global world.

Burn the American flag, we believe in expression of freedom..no one gives a damn what my father sacrificed his life for..or the WWI and WWII, the Viet Namm....I could go on and on.

What I believe in is what Trump says...get paid for defending the azzholes. Gives us the oil free, pay us back.

Numbskull is working on being re-elected because he needs to work on what he didn't work on when elected.

Too busy to pay attention. Doesn't know about world affairs.

Did you see what I saw?

A guy partying like bling...vacations, picking out scores on sports, and partying..partying...partying. That playground of planting seeds by his butt-wife was a joke. Especially when we import our food.

I grew up raising a garden, my mom canning, pinching pennies.

This lopsided bitch wants to tell us how to live when one family could buy a whole lot of veggies in season, can, freeze them and then save their food stamps for emergencies.

The ilk of thinking one half of the congressional a-holes could be abolished, legislatures, and no damn capaign money could save billions.

Along with pork projects and saving the rest of the world unless we demand reimbursement.

I won't vote for anyone until I get a guy in the White House who has a spine to speak without four teleprompters, speaks from the heart, cuz it affects his relationship with his wealth and foreigners, and can talk from the heart.

We CAN'T support others when our own country is suffering. Talking about food stamp abuse is a drop in the bucket..compared to all the money we send to help poor countries...

And where are the pictures exactly showing how that money improved their lives.

Obama..go back to Kenya. Go to Hawaii, stripped of your pension, no job, and pay that $5.00 a gallon of gas..your biggest problem was those "fancy phones missing in the White House that don't have a screen...and it's just horrible that you can't forward information technology in the White House.


Wish 3/4 of the nation shared that as the top priority of their problems. Most can't afford a phone or food.

Go back to reality...you skipped your way to the White House.

How dare you, on the backs of the poor..who wished they never believed in, "Change and Hope".

Fortunately, I didn't fall for your "too good to be true horseshit without salt".

I guarantee no amount of money will buy you back into the "LaLa Land!" People can be fooled once...but not twice unless you guarantee those patronage jobs. You lost.
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UrRight



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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/18/2011, 7:16 pm

Except the fools who vote on "color". Even with that...I don't think he can fool them anymore.
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UrRight



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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/18/2011, 7:52 pm

happy jack wrote:
Scorpion wrote:


Democrats lined up with Republicans in the 90-6 vote that came on the heels of a similar move a week ago in the House, underscoring widespread apprehension among Obama's congressional allies over voters' strong feelings about bringing detainees to the U.S. from the prison in Cuba.


Blame Congress, if you wish, but do not lay the blame on the Republicans in Congress at that time. Lay the blame where it belongs - on Obama's so-called congressional allies, who searched and searched and searched, but just couldn't manage to find their testicles when Obama needed it most.
__________________________________________________________________________________

DITTO. My own personal opinion, no matter who posted it.
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/18/2011, 11:40 pm

UrRight wrote:
Artie60438 wrote:

The fact that over 1.5 Billion Muslims in the world haven't beheaded or killed anyone over that jackass pastor's inflammatory actions is also a sign of a tolerant religion.


You are wrong, ARTiE. Millions of women have been raped, tortured and beheaded.
That's not even close to being true.
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Heretic

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/19/2011, 8:50 am

happy jack wrote:
There is a wee bit of a difference between those who attempt to enact legislation to ban flag burning and those who burn down city blocks and murder innocent people...

Yeah, I thought that was an extremely poor comparison, too, but otherwise a good article.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/19/2011, 10:02 am

Heretic wrote:
happy jack wrote:
There is a wee bit of a difference between those who attempt to enact legislation to ban flag burning and those who burn down city blocks and murder innocent people...

Yeah, I thought that was an extremely poor comparison, too, but otherwise a good article.
Yeah, it was an otherwise reasonable article. Not sure why that was slipped in there.
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Scorpion

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/19/2011, 5:04 pm

happy jack wrote:
Heretic wrote:
happy jack wrote:
There is a wee bit of a difference between those who attempt to enact legislation to ban flag burning and those who burn down city blocks and murder innocent people...

Yeah, I thought that was an extremely poor comparison, too, but otherwise a good article.
Yeah, it was an otherwise reasonable article. Not sure why that was slipped in there.

I agree, but at least burning the flag qualifies as "desecration of a symbol...."

happy jack wrote:
Heretic wrote:
Cheap Signals specifically took that NYT article to task:

They reacted violently in response to desecration of a symbol, a reaction to which Americans are not immune (as can be seen in the effort every couple of years to ban burning of the flag) ...

There is a wee bit of a difference between those who attempt to enact legislation to ban flag burning and those who burn down city blocks and murder innocent people, so I would argue that most Americans are "immune" to such reactions, with the exception of those responsible for the Rodney King riots, which, of course, had nothing to do with flag burning.

In this context, I really don't see the purpose in bringing up the "Rodney King riots." You're right when you say that they "had nothing to do with flag burning." In fact, the riots had nothing to do with the "desecration of a symbol" at all, did they?

So I'm "not sure why that was slipped in there," either.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/19/2011, 9:25 pm

Scorpion wrote:


In this context, I really don't see the purpose in bringing up the "Rodney King riots." You're right when you say that they "had nothing to do with flag burning." In fact, the riots had nothing to do with the "desecration of a symbol" at all, did they?

So I'm "not sure why that was slipped in there," either.
Just making the point that some Americans are not immune to violent reaction over perceived slights.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Religion of Peace   4/22/2011, 9:18 pm

Artie60438 wrote:
happy jack wrote:
Artie60438 wrote:

The fact that over 1.5 Billion Muslims in the world haven't beheaded or killed anyone over that jackass pastor's inflammatory actions is also a sign of a tolerant religion.
Who do you ultimately blame for the killings and beheadings?
Do you blame a pathetic, insignificant little man who burned a solitary book thousands of miles away from where the killings occurred?
Or do you blame those who actually carried out the killings and beheadings?
(Hint: They were not Mormons.)[/b
I blame them both.


Last week brought a sober reminder that every religion has its
extremists, as Christian radicals burned one copy of the Quran.

(and Muslim radicals attacked a half-dozen churches, burned dozens of
Bibles, and slaughtered 321 people in 26 terror attacks in just 7 days).

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