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 Happenings in Wisconsin

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Scorpion

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/1/2011, 1:23 pm

happy jack wrote:
Scorpion wrote:
It is, in effect, nothing more than a filibuster.
No.
You are obliged to show up for a filibuster.

Under the Senate rules in Wisconsin, there is no way to stop the legislation by "showing up."

Actually, it takes quite a bit of political courage, and I imagine quite a bit of discomfort and inconvenience, for the Democrats to leave the state for a cause that they believe in... They had no way of knowing how this was going play with their constituents. I seriously doubt that they expected to be hailed as heroes, but that's exactly what appears to have happened.

happy jack wrote:
What they are doing, in effect, is emulating Brave Sir Robin.

That was already a pretty lame talking point when this whole saga began, but now it's laughable.

"That old dog won't hunt anymore," Jack.



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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/1/2011, 10:00 pm

Bill circulating in Legislature to end spoof calls
Quote :
Although representatives deny any connection to the recent prank call on the governor, two legislators began circulating a bill Monday that would ban making trick calls masking the caller’s true identity.

Sen. Mary Lazich, R-Waukesha, and Rep. Mark Honadel, R-Milwaukee, authored a bill that would prohibit tricking the call’s recipient into believing the caller is someone they are not for malicious purposes.

In the middle of their budget crisis this is what their priorities are? Let's make sure our idiot Governor doesn't get punked again!
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Scorpion

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/2/2011, 11:52 am

Artie60438 wrote:
Bill circulating in Legislature to end spoof calls
Quote :
Although representatives deny any connection to the recent prank call on the governor, two legislators began circulating a bill Monday that would ban making trick calls masking the caller’s true identity.

Sen. Mary Lazich, R-Waukesha, and Rep. Mark Honadel, R-Milwaukee, authored a bill that would prohibit tricking the call’s recipient into believing the caller is someone they are not for malicious purposes.

In the middle of their budget crisis this is what their priorities are? Let's make sure our idiot Governor doesn't get punked again!

Timing aside, I really don't see anything wrong with this legislation. It's designed to protect consumers, has been proposed before, and in any case, hasn't even been scheduled for a committee hearing at this point.


From the same article...

Quote :
Lawmakers introduced the bill at the end of the last session but ran out of time to pass it, Vick said.

The bill has already garnered some outside support.

“Transparency and honesty are always better than secrecy and deception. If this bill will help protect consumers, it deserves a hearing and deserves to be passed,” said Jay Heck, executive director of Common Cause in Wisconsin.

The bill is not yet scheduled for a committee hearing.
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/4/2011, 5:28 pm

There must be a shortage of bobbleheads to poll....

Rasmussen (yes, Rasmussen) finds Walker disapproval at 57%
Quote :
Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker's efforts to strip public employee unions of most of their collective bargaining rights appears to be so unpopular, that a Rasmussen poll now finds that almost 60% of likely Wisconsin voters disapprove of his job performance. ... In the poll, 57% of respondents said they disapprove of Walker's job performance -- including 48% who say they strongly disapprove. Meanwhile, only 43% said they approve of the job Walker is doing.
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Heretic

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/4/2011, 10:12 pm

Although Walker's fine for a while, residents of WI are already moving to recall a few of the other Republican politicians involved, aren't they?
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/4/2011, 11:01 pm

Heretic wrote:
Although Walker's fine for a while, residents of WI are already moving to recall a few of the other Republican politicians involved, aren't they?
Yes. With Recall Push, Wisconsin Union Fight Enters Phase Two
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Scorpion

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/4/2011, 11:34 pm

Artie60438 wrote:
Heretic wrote:
Although Walker's fine for a while, residents of WI are already moving to recall a few of the other Republican politicians involved, aren't they?
Yes. With Recall Push, Wisconsin Union Fight Enters Phase Two

Found a great article that breaks down which senators are the most vulnerable to a recall, based upon voting patterns in 2008 and 2010. There are movements to recall senators from both sides. Only those senators elected in 2008 are vulnerable.

Which state senators are vulnerable to recall?

Apparently 8 Republican Senators are eligible for recall. If the Democrats can unseat 3 of them, without losing any of their own, they can take back the Wisconsin Senate. Generally recall elections don't generate a very high turnout, but I don't think that it's a stretch to expect the Democratic voters may turn out in droves to get rid of some of these guys. I guess we'll find out in the next couple of months.

As Paul stated (quite correctly) on the first page of this thread...

Paul87920 wrote:
It's their own damn fault for staying home last November. Same goes for Indiana. I posted in another thread somewhere around this forum that Indiana specifically had the same amount of Republicans turn out that they did in the last couple of elections. Democrats on the other hand stayed home.


Walker and the Republicans have really energized the Democratic base. I don't think they will "stay home" if they have an opportunity to derail Walker's agenda. Of course, recall attempts fail more often than they succeed, but the Republicans have "kicked a hornets nest," and IMHO, some of them are likely to get stung.
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/6/2011, 10:44 pm

Anyone know if the Koch Bros provided goodie bags for the 600 people they suckered in to attend?...

Pro-Walker Bus Tour Ends with a Whimper
Questions arise about Joe the Plumber's drawing power
Charles Johnson

A four-day Wisconsin bus tour paid for by the Koch Brothers and starring Joe the Plumber has fizzled to an end in Madison.
The rally, held in Exhibition Hall at the Alliant Energy Center, drew
about 600 people, said Matt Seaholm, state director for the sponsoring
group, Americans for Prosperity. The turnout was the largest on the
10-city tour, he said.
Meanwhile, thousands of protesters once again surrounded the state
Capitol to speak out against Walker’s plan to curtail collective
bargaining, though the gathering was considerably smaller than
Saturday’s rally of 30,000 or so.
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/9/2011, 2:15 pm

Wisconsin State Senate Republicans Took Hundreds Of Thousands In Government Farm Subsidies
Quote :
WASHINGTON -- At least three of the Wisconsin state Senate Republicans currently demanding that public workers sacrifice benefits, wages and even collective bargaining rights for the sake of the budget have applied for and received hundreds of thousands of dollars in federal farm subsidies, a Huffington Post review of state and federal records shows.

From 1995 through 2009, state Sens. Luther Olsen, Dale Schultz and Sheila Harsdorf all had stakes in farms that received between them more than $300,000 in taxpayer funds.

Those federal appropriations had no direct impact on the state’s current budget woes, but the cash spent on those subsidies, which went to support a range of functions -- from soybean production to small hog operations -- could have been used elsewhere, perhaps even in Wisconsin. More than that, critics say, it muddles the notion, pushed by these lawmakers and Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker (R), that only they are serious about reining in an overextended, overspent government.
Socialist Welfare for Rich Republicans! Shocked
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UrRight



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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/9/2011, 4:01 pm

You are a pussy when ya run from your job.

To make an argument and point, you don't run from your boss...the people who elected you to make decisions on your behalf.

INDIANA IS AS BAXKWARDS AS THE A HOLE WALKER.
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Scorpion

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/9/2011, 4:51 pm

Asked and answered...

Scorpion wrote:
happy jack wrote:
Scorpion wrote:
It is, in effect, nothing more than a filibuster.
No.
You are obliged to show up for a filibuster.

Under the Senate rules in Wisconsin, there is no way to stop the legislation by "showing up."

Actually, it takes quite a bit of political courage, and I imagine quite a bit of discomfort and inconvenience, for the Democrats to leave the state for a cause that they believe in... They had no way of knowing how this was going play with their constituents. I seriously doubt that they expected to be hailed as heroes, but that's exactly what appears to have happened.

happy jack wrote:
What they are doing, in effect, is emulating Brave Sir Robin.

That was already a pretty lame talking point when this whole saga began, but now it's laughable.

"That old dog won't hunt anymore," Jack.



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Scorpion

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/9/2011, 9:41 pm

Wow - The Republicans are really going to be sorry that they did this...

G.O.P. Tactic Ends Stalemate in Wisconsin Union Fight

Quote :
The Republicans control the Senate but had been blocked from voting on the issue after Senate Democrats left the state last month to prevent a quorum. Instead, the Republicans used a procedural maneuver Wednesday to force the collective bargaining measure through: they removed elements of Governor Walker’s bill that were technically related to appropriating funds, thus lifting a requirement that 20 senators be present for a vote. In the end, the Senate’s 19 Republicans approved the measure, 18 to 1, without any debate on the floor or a single Democrat in the room.

Quote :
"In 30 minutes, 18 state senators undid 50 years of civil rights in Wisconsin. Their disrespect for the people of Wisconsin and their rights is an outrage that will never be forgotten," said Democratic Senate Minority Leader Mark Miller. "Tonight, 18 Senate Republicans conspired to take government away from the people."

Let the recalls begin!
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/9/2011, 10:08 pm

In the end what this proves is that it was never about the budget. It was always about busting the Unions.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/10/2011, 10:35 am

Scorpion wrote:
Wow - The Republicans are really going to be sorry that they did this...

G.O.P. Tactic Ends Stalemate in Wisconsin Union Fight

Quote :
The Republicans control the Senate but had been blocked from voting on the issue after Senate Democrats left the state last month to prevent a quorum. Instead, the Republicans used a procedural maneuver Wednesday to force the collective bargaining measure through: they removed elements of Governor Walker’s bill that were technically related to appropriating funds, thus lifting a requirement that 20 senators be present for a vote. In the end, the Senate’s 19 Republicans approved the measure, 18 to 1, without any debate on the floor or a single Democrat in the room.

Quote :
"In 30 minutes, 18 state senators undid 50 years of civil rights in Wisconsin. Their disrespect for the people of Wisconsin and their rights is an outrage that will never be forgotten," said Democratic Senate Minority Leader Mark Miller. "Tonight, 18 Senate Republicans conspired to take government away from the people."

Let the recalls begin!
I'm willing to bet that the only ones who would vote for a recall are those who wouldn't be supporting the Republicans under any circumstances anyway, so I doubt that a recall would have as much traction as you imagine.
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Scorpion

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/10/2011, 11:46 am

happy jack wrote:
Scorpion wrote:
Wow - The Republicans are really going to be sorry that they did this...

G.O.P. Tactic Ends Stalemate in Wisconsin Union Fight

Quote :
The Republicans control the Senate but had been blocked from voting on the issue after Senate Democrats left the state last month to prevent a quorum. Instead, the Republicans used a procedural maneuver Wednesday to force the collective bargaining measure through: they removed elements of Governor Walker’s bill that were technically related to appropriating funds, thus lifting a requirement that 20 senators be present for a vote. In the end, the Senate’s 19 Republicans approved the measure, 18 to 1, without any debate on the floor or a single Democrat in the room.

Quote :
"In 30 minutes, 18 state senators undid 50 years of civil rights in Wisconsin. Their disrespect for the people of Wisconsin and their rights is an outrage that will never be forgotten," said Democratic Senate Minority Leader Mark Miller. "Tonight, 18 Senate Republicans conspired to take government away from the people."

Let the recalls begin!
I'm willing to bet that the only ones who would vote for a recall are those who wouldn't be supporting the Republicans under any circumstances anyway, so I doubt that a recall would have as much traction as you imagine.

We shall see soon enough. As pointed out earlier in this thread, Democratic turnout in Wisconsin in 2010 was less than stellar. Recall efforts against the Republicans that were already underway will get a huge boost from the Republican decision to "go nuclear" on this issue. If the Democrats turn out in huge numbers, the Republicans are toast.

Every single Senator that is eligible for recall, regardless of party affiliation, has a recall petition circulating against them. Recall elections ordinarily don't produce a huge turnout, but this is not an ordinary situation. Republicans have now declared war on the Democrats and the unions in Wisconsin. IMHO, the Republicans have made a huge tactical miscalculation, and now they are going to pay for it.



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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/10/2011, 12:09 pm

Scorpion wrote:
happy jack wrote:
Scorpion wrote:
Wow - The Republicans are really going to be sorry that they did this...

G.O.P. Tactic Ends Stalemate in Wisconsin Union Fight





Let the recalls begin!
I'm willing to bet that the only ones who would vote for a recall are those who wouldn't be supporting the Republicans under any circumstances anyway, so I doubt that a recall would have as much traction as you imagine.

We shall see soon enough. As pointed out earlier in this thread, Democratic turnout in Wisconsin in 2010 was less than stellar. Recall efforts against the Republicans that were already underway will get a huge boost from the Republican decision to "go nuclear" on this issue. If the Democrats turn out in huge numbers, the Republicans are toast.

Every single Senator that is eligible for recall, regardless of party affiliation, has a recall petition circulating against them. Recall elections ordinarily don't produce a huge turnout, but this is not an ordinary situation. Republicans have now declared war on the Democrats and the unions in Wisconsin. IMHO, the Republicans have made a huge tactical miscalculation, and now they are going to pay for it.
Maybe. But you have to keep in mind that there may be a good number of Democrats in Wisconsin who are not members of any of the public employees' unions, who are taxpayers, who may not be as sympathetic to the public employees' unions as you think, and who may not be inclined to bother showing up for any recall elections.
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Scorpion

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/10/2011, 12:24 pm

happy jack wrote:
Scorpion wrote:
happy jack wrote:

I'm willing to bet that the only ones who would vote for a recall are those who wouldn't be supporting the Republicans under any circumstances anyway, so I doubt that a recall would have as much traction as you imagine.

We shall see soon enough. As pointed out earlier in this thread, Democratic turnout in Wisconsin in 2010 was less than stellar. Recall efforts against the Republicans that were already underway will get a huge boost from the Republican decision to "go nuclear" on this issue. If the Democrats turn out in huge numbers, the Republicans are toast.

Every single Senator that is eligible for recall, regardless of party affiliation, has a recall petition circulating against them. Recall elections ordinarily don't produce a huge turnout, but this is not an ordinary situation. Republicans have now declared war on the Democrats and the unions in Wisconsin. IMHO, the Republicans have made a huge tactical miscalculation, and now they are going to pay for it.
Maybe. But you have to keep in mind that there may be a good number of Democrats in Wisconsin who are not members of any of the public employees' unions, who are taxpayers, who may not be as sympathetic to the public employees' unions as you think, and who may not be inclined to bother showing up for any recall elections.

So far, the polls have shown otherwise, Jack. You would be correct if the unions hadn't already agreed to concessions. But they did agree to concessions, and the Democratic voters in Wisconsin know that. You don't have to be a member of a public union to be outraged at what the Republicans have done. I'm fairly certain that the "war on unions" will bring out Democratic voters, regardless of whether they belong to a union or not.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/10/2011, 1:59 pm

Well, on the bright side, they didn't do anything nearly as threatening as placing crosshairs on a map.



http://www.620wtmj.com/news/local/117732923.html

Capitol Chaos: Lawmakers Get Death Threats

By Jon Byman

Story Updated: Mar 10, 2011

MADISON - The State Department of Justice confirms that it is investigating several death threats against a number of lawmakers in response to the legislature's move to strip employees of many collective bargaining rights.
Among the threats the Justice Department is investigationg is one that was emailed to Republican Senators Wednesday night. Newsradio 620 WTMJ has obtained that email.

The following is the unedited email:

Please put your things in order because you will be killed and your familes
will also be killed due to your actions in the last 8 weeks. Please explain
to them that this is because if we get rid of you and your families then it
will save the rights of 300,000 people and also be able to close the deficit
that you have created. I hope you have a good time in hell. Read below for
more information on possible scenarios in which you will die.

WE want to make this perfectly clear. Because of your actions today and in
the past couple of weeks I and the group of people that are working with me
have decided that we've had enough. We feel that you and the people that
support the dictator have to die. We have tried many other ways of dealing
with your corruption but you have taken things too far and we will not stand
for it any longer. So, this is how it's going to happen: I as well as many
others know where you and your family live, it's a matter of public records.
We have all planned to assult you by arriving at your house and putting a
nice little bullet in your head. However, we decided that we wouldn't leave
it there. We also have decided that this may not be enough to send the
message to you since you are so "high" on Koch and have decided that you are
now going to single handedly make this a dictatorship instead of a
demorcratic process. So we have also built several bombs that we have placed
in various locations around the areas in which we know that you frequent.
This includes, your house, your car, the state capitol, and well I won't
tell you all of them because that's just no fun. Since we know that you are
not smart enough to figure out why this is happening to you we have decided
to make it perfectly clear to you. If you and your goonies feel that it's
necessary to strip the rights of 300,000 people and ruin their lives, making
them unable to feed, clothe, and provide the necessities to their families
and themselves then We Will "get rid of" (in which I mean kill) you. Please
understand that this does not include the heroic Rep. Senator that risked
everything to go aganist what you and your goonies wanted him to do. We feel
that it's worth our lives to do this, because we would be saving the lives
of 300,000 people. Please make your peace with God as soon as possible and
say goodbye to your loved ones we will not wait any longer. YOU WILL DIE!!!!
Reply Reply to all Forward

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chuckmo48

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/10/2011, 5:17 pm

“These are the values inspiring those brave workers in Poland ... They remind us that where free unions and collective bargaining are forbidden, freedom is lost."
-- Ronald Reagan, Labor Day address, 1980
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Scorpion

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/10/2011, 7:27 pm

happy jack wrote:
Well, on the bright side, they didn't do anything nearly as threatening as placing crosshairs on a map.

http://www.620wtmj.com/news/local/117732923.html

Capitol Chaos: Lawmakers Get Death Threats

Yeah. Well it will be really interesting when we find out who actually sent this email. At first glance, it seems really over the top to me. Either it's been fabricated by someone trying to make the unions look bad, or it is from some frickin' maniac. Let's hope that the Justice Department gets to the bottom of this ASAP.
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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/11/2011, 2:22 pm

Scorpion wrote:
happy jack wrote:
Well, on the bright side, they didn't do anything nearly as threatening as placing crosshairs on a map.

http://www.620wtmj.com/news/local/117732923.html

Capitol Chaos: Lawmakers Get Death Threats

Yeah. Well it will be really interesting when we find out who actually sent this email. At first glance, it seems really over the top to me. Either it's been fabricated by someone trying to make the unions look bad, or it is from some frickin' maniac. Let's hope that the Justice Department gets to the bottom of this ASAP.
Yes, that must be the case. Rolling Eyes
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Scorpion

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/11/2011, 3:04 pm

happy jack wrote:
Scorpion wrote:
happy jack wrote:
Well, on the bright side, they didn't do anything nearly as threatening as placing crosshairs on a map.

http://www.620wtmj.com/news/local/117732923.html

Capitol Chaos: Lawmakers Get Death Threats

Yeah. Well it will be really interesting when we find out who actually sent this email. At first glance, it seems really over the top to me. Either it's been fabricated by someone trying to make the unions look bad, or it is from some frickin' maniac. Let's hope that the Justice Department gets to the bottom of this ASAP.
Yes, that must be the case.Rolling Eyes

What? You don't think that's possible? Even if it's not a fabrication, nobody in their right mind would send such an e-mail, because the Justice Department will find out who did this.

I didn't say it was a fabrication. I said that it could be. And we don't know that it isn't at this point, do we? What's your point, Jack? Are you saying that the sentiments in this email reflect the opinion of the majority of union members? Are you frickin' kidding?

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happy jack

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/11/2011, 3:57 pm

Scorpion wrote:

Even if it's not a fabrication, nobody in their right mind would send such an e-mail,
Perhaps the person who sent it was not in his or her right mind.

Scorpion wrote:

Are you saying that the sentiments in this email reflect the opinion of the majority of union members? Are you frickin' kidding?
It is what it is - no more, no less.
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Artie60438

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/11/2011, 5:10 pm

We can now officially remove all doubt as to what the Republicans goal in Wisconsin was all along:
State Senate Majority Leader Scott Fitzgerald (R-WI)....
Quote :
If we win this battle, and the money is not there under the auspices of the unions, certainly what you’re going to find is President Obama is going to have a much difficult, much more difficult time getting elected and winning the state of Wisconsin.
http://thinkprogress.org/2011/03/09/scott-fitzgerald-obama/
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Scorpion

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PostSubject: Re: Happenings in Wisconsin    3/11/2011, 5:46 pm

happy jack wrote:
Scorpion wrote:

Even if it's not a fabrication, nobody in their right mind would send such an e-mail,
Perhaps the person who sent it was not in his or her right mind.

Wow - You think?

happy jack wrote:

Scorpion wrote:

Are you saying that the sentiments in this email reflect the opinion of the majority of union members? Are you frickin' kidding?
It is what it is - no more, no less.

Can't argue with that!
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